/biz/ - Business & Finance

Because the people who benefit from the current dollar hold all the cards. For now at least.

>>641702

>This is what moderators on the Ron Paul forums actually believe

So can you petrodoallar fags tell me something.

Whats the difference between a petrodoallar and a reserve currency?

All I've ever been described is that its a reserve currency.

>Uhhhh da dollar is used for oil

It's used for everything though.

>Welll uhh wars

Yes that's a big reason for reserve currency, we control the trade routes, why was the pound a reserve currency for so long.

>But uhhhh murrika evil

So whats a more stable currency you could recommend?

They always yell gold at me because even if the dollar sucks its better than the other 3rd world shitholes currency.

So by petrodollar do you mean reserve currency?

Do you recommend we trade in the biggest commodities market with Yen or Euro?

>>641702

>Tell me again why we don't return to the gold peg

Because a substantial segment of the populace, especially farmers and laborers, were crushed under the gold standard and were constantly agitating for its elimination, either by a bimetallic standard (which would have caused huge inflation) or a straight fiat currency. They made up well over 50% of the population and held total sway over one and partial sway over another major political party.

Nowadays, the only people who dislike fiat currencies are either people who own lots of gold (and would therefore benefit from a repricing) or who own lots of debt and hate inflation. This is maybe, maybe 5% of the population, and they have minor influence on one and zero influence on the other political party.

There you go.

>>641702
>central bank can manipulate the supply
because when the central bank is run by someone honest like Margaret Thatcher they can reduce price volatility more compared to the gold standard

>>641714

http://ftmdaily.com/preparing-for-the-collapse-of-the-petrodollar-system/

>>641739
>own lots of debt and hate inflation

Why would anyone with a lot of debt hate inflation?

paying back your mortgage of 100k is awesome when a loaf of bread costs 1000 bucks and wages have had to shoot through the roof to keep people fed.

>>641760

Yeah so wtf is the petrodollar system?

Do you mean reserve currency?

The dollar will fail?

None of these answered my question of what the fuck is a petrodollar.

>>641762
The person who owns the debt is the one loaning it out.

>>641762

The people who own debt, i.e. who gave the money to the person who took it out.

Obviously people who have lots of debt like inflation, that's the reason why farmers and laborers want to get off the gold standard so much.

>>641702
Gold standard didn't work because you can't modify the money supply to stabilize the economy during a crisis.

Think Greece... them being on the Euro is equivalent to a nation being on a gold standard... yeah, things are going great for them... lol

>>641773

>Think Greece... them being on the Euro is equivalent to a nation being on a gold standard... yeah, things are going great for them... lol

Germany being on the Euro doesn't hurt them though, because they are an industrious people. Greeks on the other hand are lazy Turks.

The Greek state spends too much money and doesn't raise enough revenue. Simple as that. If they had kept their native currency, Greece would still be a shit place to live.

>>641702
>central bank can manipulate the supply and you can't compare the prices from one year to the next

TOP KEKKER

>how do i into math

>>641763

>None of these answered my question of what the fuck is a petrodollar.

Why not? Are you illiterate? Are you new to the concept of hyperlinks?

Al you had to do was read, but instead you can wallow in your ignorance.

>>641702
because gold is just a shiny rock

oil makes the world turn since the invention of the automobile and therefore it's only natural it would become the backbone of finance. it's as simple as it being the most important thing to have control over... as opposed to gold which is a shiny rock

>>641714
Petrodollar means the US dollar. Petrodollar just alludes to the fact that the US made a deal with Saudi Arabia (or with OPEC) that they have to accept US dollars for the oil. Which has a deflationary effect on the US dollar.

>So whats a more stable currency you could recommend?
Pegging the currencies to gold. Because now even the US is becoming more and more socialistic. And socialists always bankrupt a company, town, country by inviting leeches and driving away entrepreneurs.

tl;dr Gold standard to save the world from socialism

>>641702
>>641794

also the petrodollar is a theory (albeit an interesting one)

the actual thing that backs US dollars is market demand for US debt which is backed by both global influence/force and the ability to collect taxes in dollars going forward

so its not like we are on the oil standard

>>641793


>Write guide on fucking bitches

You ask what are bitches?

I say
>Why not? Are you illiterate? Are you new to the concept of hyperlinks?

Makes sense.
So you have no idea what you're talking about like everyone else.

>>641795

But all goods are traded in the value of dollars.

So did they collude with the world to do this?
Or is the dollar just a reserve currency?

>>641739

So you are basically saying we are seeing the limits of democracy because people are short-sighted. They don't see the long-term consequences of debt addiction and overpopulation.

>>641801
>But all goods are traded in the value of dollars.
No. That's wrong.

>Or is the dollar just a reserve currency?
Yes. Backed by the US armed forces.

>>641801

>So you have no idea what you're talking about like everyone else.

I see. You want to be stupid, it's not that you can't help it. Let me spoonfeed the baby!

A petrodollar and a reserve currency are not mutually inclusive. The US formerly enjoyed reserve currency status because dollars were pegged to gold. In 1974, that peg was removed, which put the dollar's role as a reserve currency at risk, because other nations didn't want to be put on the hook for a currency that could be devalued.

In response, the US brokered a deal with the Saudis to accept payment for their oil only in dollars, and to buy US-backed securities with the profit, in exchange for various sorts of aid and protection from Israel. Other OPEC nations followed suit, which forced most of the world to buy dollars in order to exchange them for oil. These are known as petrodollars.

So you see, you insufferable idiot, the difference between a petrodollar and a reserve currency is that one refers to a method of payment for a specific good, while the other refers to a method of payment that many nations use as a safe haven. People don't treat USD as a reserve currency because it's a stable store of value, they do it simply because they need it to buy oil. For now anyway, as some nations refuse or have refused before to recognize it, including Iran, Iraq (under Sadaam Hussein), Syria, Libya, Russia, North Korea... Hmmm, I think all of those have something in common.

As for the rest of your idiocy, USD is not, in fact, "used for everything", we don't "control the trade routes" or demand use of USD between third parties outside of the petrodollar system, and yes, gold is a more stable store of value.

TL;DR: no not tl;dr, actually read the fucking shit before you spout more ignorance you stupid motherfucker.

>Tell me again why we don't return to the gold peg
Because it increases short term price volatility and reduces the effectiveness of monetary policy during an economic crisis or national emergency. It also allows an additional means for a foreign nation (or just a profit motivated black market) to conduct a form of economic warfare by taking advantage of unofficial exchange rates.

The gold standard is obsolete and was abandoned by every country on the planet for a reason.

>>641816

So what you're saying is, this is artificial.

So we should bring back the gold standard and do the same thing?

Then why cry about the petrodollar?
You literally want the same shit with a little more consumer protection for just the US.

>demand use of USD between third parties outside of the petrodollar system

Yes they chose to

Basically, you want a gold standard, and don't really care about the petrodollar?

I don't get all the crying.

If our money was backed by gold the Saudis could still do the same shit with it. Nothing would change at all.

And Iran trades gold for oil in the value of US dollars.

>>641824

>The gold standard is obsolete and was abandoned by every country on the planet for a reason.

That reason being to assert control over the currency market to support and maintain the status quo.

>>641827
>maintain the status quo
If by status quo you mean a stable economy, sure.

>>641764
>>641765

>own debt
>have debt

you people suck at english.

i think you mean creditor and debtor.

i read those petrodollar articles... there is essentially no economic basis for any of the arguments that retard is making.

>>641826

>So what you're saying is, this is artificial.

If by "artificial" you mean the petrodollar wouldn't really exist if not for the deals the US brokered, then yes.

>So we should bring back the gold standard and do the same thing?

I don't particularly care if the gold standard is reinstated or not. It's not really necessary to push that unless a nation is restricting transactions by its citizens to its own currency. That's not explicitly the case here, though obviously the state and the financial bloc try to discourage anything else.

>Then why cry about the petrodollar?

Because we waste money and lives killing brown people half a world away just so the haves can keep the house of cards standing a little longer.

>You literally want the same shit with a little more consumer protection for just the US.

I don't want anything. I'm just calling the system out for what it is.

>Yes they chose to

"Choose" being a relative term when the choice is USD vs. no oil. That's like saying you chose to give that mugger your wallet.

>If our money was backed by gold the Saudis could still do the same shit with it. Nothing would change at all.

They certainly could. Would they? Did they before they received aid to do so?

>And Iran trades gold for oil in the value of US dollars.

But they don't want to. They routinely threaten to drop it. And we routinely threaten to bomb the shit out of them. Axis of Evil and whatnot.

>>641830

Yes, thank God for our stable economy.

>>641847
Compared to the gold standard? Yes.

>>641847

wealth disparity creates asset bubbles as fewer and fewer people with money dump assets into more and more narrow categories of the market.

there isn't an economy, ever created by humans, that solved this issue - short of wealth redistribution. and the only wealth distribution that has ever taken place in the course of human history is rich people paying the government not to redistribute their money.

just take advantage of it. your chart makes it clear as day, we are at another peak and you can cash out now and get back in about a year later...

>>641702

Good luck having any sort of economic growth without fiat. Your living standards would be much worse without fiat currency. Face it.

>>641844

>But they don't want to. They routinely threaten to drop it. And we routinely threaten to bomb the shit out of them. Axis of Evil and whatnot.

The gold is to circumvent sanctions, they could do it in whatever currency they wanted. So that makes no fucking sense.

>They certainly could. Would they? Did they before they received aid to do so?

They're defiantly doing worse now......
I don't know what the fuck you're trying to say, they'll fuck themselves because??? ?? ????

>Choose" being a relative term when the choice is USD vs. no oil. That's like saying you chose to give that mugger your wallet

I bet this literally stopped you from using dollars, Chris Kyle was gonna hunt you down. And what about countries that produce their own oil?

>Because we waste money and lives killing brown people half a world away just so the haves can keep the house of cards standing a little longer.

So you want Israel out of US politics?
Because that's how you fix this.

>If by "artificial" you mean the petrodollar wouldn't really exist if not for the deals the US brokered, then yes.

Yes they would just chose to use it, like Iran does.

But you're just gonna say its forced with no proof and act like the USD isn't and hasn't been the strongest currency for years.

>>641866

>The gold is to circumvent sanctions, they could do it in whatever currency they wanted. So that makes no fucking sense.

They could, yes. But they deal in the currency of the Great Satan, much to their chagrin.

>They're defiantly doing worse now...... I don't know what the fuck you're trying to say, they'll fuck themselves because??? ?? ????

Of course they're doing better. They're sitting on one of the world's largest reservoirs of oil that requires little effort to extract. Let's say that the petrodollar didn't exist, so that the US would not attempt to enforce its use. In what way would they then be "fucking themselves" by accepting currencies other than USD? Most every multinational entity dealing in commodities has figured out how to hedge currency risk, I think the Saudis could manage.

>I bet this literally stopped you from using dollars, Chris Kyle was gonna hunt you down. And what about countries that produce their own oil?

I use dollars almost exclusively, largely because I'm a US resident. As I said previously, I don't have a problem with the concept of a fiat currency, only how it gets manipulated to cover one's ass (and not yours or mine).

There's no reason or feasible means for the US to force petrodollar use for oil traded within a given country. That doesn't add value to the status of a reserve currency.

>So you want Israel out of US politics? Because that's how you fix this.

It is? Then why does the US give more aid to Israel's "enemies" than Israel itself? Doesn't that seem counterproductive?

>Yes they would just chose to use it, like Iran does. But you're just gonna say its forced with no proof and act like the USD isn't and hasn't been the strongest currency for years.

I'm not saying they wouldn't keep using it and I'm not saying USD isn't a strong currency. I am saying there are reasons for both, and one of those reasons is not because people around the world love the United States' policies so much they gotta have USD.

>>641915

>It is? Then why does the US give more aid to Israel's "enemies" than Israel itself? Doesn't that seem counterproductive?

This is because they use it to destabilize their "enemies"(neighbors).

If Israel is such a great priority to politicians give money if it wasn't in their favor?

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/egypt-protest-police-us-made-tear-gas-demonstrators/story?id=12785598

The corrupt leaders also spend a ton of it on themselves, leading to resentment and things like the Arab spring.

How many Lambos, and houses did Mubarak own?

This made more sense before last summer, but if the "petrodollar" deals were stopped now would anyone leave the USD benchmark for selling commodities?

>>641702
You know the value of gold is just as invented and arbitrary as everything else, right?

>>641965
The sad thing is that most gold-bugs don't realize that. They think its market price represents some sort of intrinsic value.

>>641847

It really is extraordinarily stable, and real stock returns have actually been higher post-gold standard than pre-standard.

>>641838
Just because you don't know the difference being owning debt ("to own debt") and being in debt (only YOU used the phrase "have debt"), it doesn't mean that anyone else's English sucks.

>>641943

>This is because they use it to destabilize their "enemies"(neighbors).

Thing is, it's not just sports cars and mansions. It's weapons. Abrams, F-16s, Javelins, M4s. If your friend and his neighbor were feuding, would you go to the neighbor's house and give him a gun in hopes he'd accidentally shoot himself?

>This made more sense before last summer, but if the "petrodollar" deals were stopped now would anyone leave the USD benchmark for selling commodities?

Would they leave? I dunno. The question is, would they have a reason to stay?

I mean, what's the point of trying to have your currency become a reserve currency, anyway? It's to create external demand for it, right? So it doesn't lose value when the supply is increased? So you can finance additional expenditures without increasing revenue or debasing your currency?

Previously, that wasn't a problem, as it was pegged to gold. People knew, if they bought a dollar, later on they could trade that dollar for X ounces of gold. But then the supply is relatively fixed. So to keep value afloat, the powers-that-be traded constant supply with increasing demand, by requiring people to buy it to buy something else they needed.

Oil is like gold and other commodities in a lot of ways. But it's crucially different in two ways. One, consumer demand for oil is a lot higher than that of gold. Two, the cost of recovering post-consumer gold (recycling, etc.) is a lot lower than the cost of recovering post-consumer oil (geological processes). So sooner or later the petrodollar is going away, if for no other reason than we run out of oil.

The question then is, what's the point in holding USD? If it can lose most of its value suddenly at any time, if you don't need it to do anything in particular, why do you need it?

And that's a problem for this severely indebted nation, and the only reason I'm going on about this.

>>641855
>>641976

It's stable, huh?

Both of you are comparing swerving your car to stay on the road to finally breaking through the guardrail and sailing off the cliff. "Boy, this is a smooth ride," you think to yourself as you reach terminal velocity. "I was getting jerked around pretty hard back there."

The funny thing is it should actually be stable, at least up to the point of impact, but it's not as monetary policy keeps pushing people into riskier assets. You can't put your money in a savings account, or hide it under your mattress, you'll get raped by ZIRP/NIRP and inflation. Bonds and CDs are a joke, one's funny money and the other is useless in a world where any bank can dial up the Fed's printing press. So you go into equities, stock indices go to the moon, and the people doing it for a living have to push into junk investments like subprime loans and derivatives. Then your mortgage is upside-down, or you're putting your master's to use at Starbucks, two problems that aren't exactly bellwethers of a stable economy.

But yeah, relatively, I'm sure it's stable, right up to the point when the first person passes on a T-bill or the government writes a check that it can't cash. We'll see how stable it is then.

I bought a kilogram of silver because it looks pretty.

If it halved in value tomorrow I'd buy another couple of kilograms.

When it reaches the lofty heights I'll sell it. This was pretty much just an experiment when I had a little spare money. Essentially, will precious metals beat inflation in the short-medium term?

>>642028
>NIRP
Is this an euphemism for bail in?

>>642052
>will precious metals beat inflation in the short-medium term?
Short answer: probably not

In the long term, however, you might come out ahead

>>642052
>will precious metals beat inflation in the short-medium term?

No. They are too overvalued on current prices, you will experience negative real returns on average. The "fair" price of gold right now is around $800/oz.

>>642090
Perhaps I'll waittans Dee what happens then.

Its nice to physically own the metal though

Think about what would happen to the US gov gold stockpile if we went back to a fixed gold standard, given that the US trade debt is so large? Which way would the gold flow (hint: think about why the gold window was closed in 1971)?

The world needs fiat currency. However the world also needs a store of value that doesn't compete with the currency. Sirs, I present to you a floating (not fixed) gold standard.

Please read FOFOA.

>>642096
The problem with most technical analysis that have 1980/90's weighted prices is that they don't account for the rise of India and China. They account for a huge portion of non industrial gold consumption, since their growing middle class can finanly afford the shiny stuff.

>>642883

Indians and Chinese buying gold with rupees and renminbi will do nothing to the price of gold in USD. It will have the net effect of driving up the price of gold in rupee and renminbi terms, but this will be offset by a corresponding fall in the renminbi or rupee against the dollar (since fewer people are willing to hold them and want gold instead).

This is the single biggest problem the "muh Chinese demand!" argument has. Goldfags rarely invest any effort into understanding how currencies innteract with each other and not gold, and the ones who do (like Jim Rogers) get curcified as heretics the instant they suggest gold isn't going to infinity. It's a very closed ecosystem.

>>641702
Petrodollar is constant demand, golddollar is constant supply. Neither one is all that great.

>>641702
I bought an ounce of gold last year. I live in the UK so I've gained £50 on this but only because the dollar is stronger. I actually regret listening to the precious metal fetishists because I get no income from this stupid metal and it just sits around looking pretty and expensive.

Same for the 40oz of silver I have. Waste of money.

We have these threads occasionally. It boils down to OP fundamentally not understanding basic economics, much less why the gold standard failed in the first place

Can't stand OP's who are this combatively ignorant.

>>643030
They were a lot more common in the early days of /biz/ before we managed to purge /pol/.

>>643030
Gold standard failed b/c gold is not backed by anything

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLL2r3hXmjA

>>643042

Yeah, but there were more cryptoshills back then too as I recall.

>>643058
The cryptoshills died off as crypto itself died. The threads just got more and more pathetic.
>>643050
Is there any place on the internet lower than the cesspools that are YouTube comment sections?

>>643061
Reddit comments, holy fuck redditors are stupid.

>>641702
For all the flaws of fiat currency, gold standard is far worse.

>>643030
So you are one of these people who just parrot their economics teachers and then wonder why you don't really earn a lot of money? The gold standard was abandoned by the UK in 1931. Since then the UK has lost influence and power relative to the rest of the world. American living standards are about the same as with the gold standard.

>gold standard sucks because price shocks to the physical commodity like new discoveries fuck with everyday prices of bread and milk
>a currency that cannot be inflated means those with existing savings will forever out perform those trying to build savings , see euro
>also implying peoples arbitrary faith in the value of a shiny rock is more legitimate than their arbitrary faith in paper

>>641793

petrodollar is a term extreme libertardians use to refer to the us dollar. When you see this term used unironically you can be sure the poster is either baiting or is actually /pol/tarded

The gold standard also incentivizes staying in cash which is bad for investment and the efficient allocation of resources.

>>641762

/biz/ ladies and gentlemen

>>641788

As someone who lives near Greece, and knows a few of them.. I approve this message.

The greeks would vote for anyone who would keep on throwing money at them.

Same in Cyprus..

Promise to pay the public sector more? YAY VOTE FOR HIM

be realistic and say 'why do we pay these guys so much, and get so little? BOOO! CAPITALIST SCUM

>>641788
>The Euro is a fiat currency
>Germany and Greece use the Euro
>It doesn't work
>This proves why the gold standard is horrible

Fiat apologists are like heroin addicts. I-I can fix my life I just need one more stimulus, heroin injection, QE.

>>643696
That's what Lehman Brothers said. And a lot of their peers. Before they were saved by the politburo.

>>643711

A Red Herring is a fallacy in which an irrelevant topic is presented in order to divert attention from the original issue. The basic idea is to "win" an argument by leading attention away from the argument and to another topic.

>>643756
Maybe your dad never told you so I'll explain how it is relevant.

>by anticipating another stimulus (QE) market participants will add more debt to their balance sheet
>bubbles start to appear
>for example systemically important banks going bankrupt thanks to this debt addiction
>the taxpayer has to bail them out

>>643688
Price instability is common in some hopelessly corrupt countries, at a certain point gold's volatility is lower.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-25917535
>...those with existing savings... out perform those trying to build savings
They receive the same returns.
>arbitrary faith in the value of a shiny rock is more legitimate than their arbitrary faith in paper
Gold cannot be forged, the natural world limits its production.
>>643692
Oil constitutes a significant proportion of GDP, if tomorrow it was traded in euros the dollar would drop suddenly as businesses exchange it for euros. This is something US policymakers have to consider. Some weird conspiracy theorists on the internet doesn't change that.
http://businessinsider.com/us-dollar-oil-prices-correlation-2014-10
>>643696
Most people have calculators and can easily adjust for inflation and would make similar decisions whatever the inflation rate. inefficient allocation occurs when there are unpredictable swings in rates of inflation and businesses can't plan ahead, volatility was low for long stretches during the 19th century while on the gold standard unlike today
>>643697
Hyperbole is typical on 4chan. The fact is both creditors and debtors matter, if your neighbor consumes less luxuries and accumulates $5000 in savings while you take out a consumer loan of $5000 it is only fair that you pay back the amount owed adjusted for inflation or you are essentially taking a shit on your neighbor's face

>>643708
in theory a central bank can achieve low levels of predictable inflation >>641757 , of course many fail to do this

Keynes once said that he believes the government has a role to play in the economy but would prefer it if the town halls were filled with scrutinous people like Hayek
>>643711
>>643756
>>643776
I can confidently place most of the blame squarely on the government.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7073131.stm

A significant proportion of subprime mortgages were backed by the government and lent by GSEs, policies like the community reinvestment act played only a small part but didn't help, sudden deregulation without giving time for the market to adapt was the fault of the government not free markets, since the government failed to anticipate the effects the market's failure to do so is irrelevant.

>>643776
>by anticipating another stimulus (QE) market participants will add more debt to their balance sheet

So, you'r saying Lehman went bankrupt because they levered up in anticipation the Fed would buy long-dated Treasury bonds and MBS's? That they somehow magically knew this would happen, despite it being totally unprecedented in the US? And that had QE started before Lehman declared bankruptcy (great job there), they would have magically become solvent?

You're fucking retarded.

Gold is just bitcoin for right-wingers. It's increasingly difficult to produce, the supply is finite, its promoters insist it's a currency, and it has no real value.

>>643839

Oh, and people who think they are secure in their ownership of it are actually fucked if the people they have holding it for them go tits up.

>>641801
If you want to learn like a child with know prior knowledge, dont make assertions and ask if they are true, just humble yourself and ask questions.

>>641976
dynamic equilibrium

>>643839
agreed, from a population growth approach commodities like water with a very low price/usefulness ratio will converge with commodities like gold with a relatively high price/usefulness ratio as usefulness becomes more important that price as t approaches infinity

>>642006
>Thing is, it's not just sports cars and mansions. It's weapons. Abrams, F-16s, Javelins, M4s. If your friend and his neighbor were feuding, would you go to the neighbor's house and give him a gun in hopes he'd accidentally shoot himself?

Not him, but that's not how it works. Many of the factions we arm are quite explicitly against whatever we're against. It's more if YOU were feuding with your friend and your friend's neighbor also harbored hatred for him. By helping the neighbor you both are better equip to fuck your friend.

It becomes a problem when your friend's neighbor shifts their hatred towards you though.

I just wanted to interject. I don't know enough about currencies to contribute.

It would be hilarious to watch everyone collecting gold for the US national debt they own. The US would be completely unable to finance any future spending.

America is built on deficit spending. The gold standard is great if you're a commie.

>>641702
>Tell me again why we don't return to the gold peg
Because you suckers fell into debt so no, you can't have my gold. It's mine, you can't steal it. This means reverting back to a gold peg would drown the US economy, annihilate equity.

Seperate power and wealth. Nixon symbolized making this distinction necessary for the continued success of the Fed.

>>644338
>It would be hilarious to watch everyone collecting gold for the US national debt they own.
They don't own the debt, they only own the interest. Bonds aren't shares of the Fed. My Fed owns the debt.

>>643708
Fiat works fine it's only problem is politicians that try to push the budget out of control. Sorry Europoors screwed the pooch on this one. USD has the power to return to surplus, the EUR doesn't.

Fiat is the most efficient medium for commerce operation.

>>643779
>Oil constitutes a significant proportion of GDP, if tomorrow it was traded in euros the dollar would drop suddenly as businesses exchange it for euros. This is something US policymakers have to consider. Some weird conspiracy theorists on the internet doesn't change that.
Except US built the oil industry and this is why we own it with manpower and on paper ownership. So policymakers aren't relevant here, we were the founders, maintainers, protectors and preservers of the oil industry. Policymakers aren't in charge here, men with guns are.

>>641702
>fall of the petro dollar

"Russia, Egypt May Exclude US Dollar And Use National Currencies In Bilateral Trade"

http://www.ibtimes.com/russia-egypt-may-exclude-us-dollar-use-national-currencies-bilateral-trade-putin-1809544


It is habeding

>>643953

>Many of the factions we arm are quite explicitly against whatever we're against.

LOL. Yeah, for how long again?

>It becomes a problem when your friend's neighbor shifts their hatred towards you though.

And how many times is that the result?

Who staged a coup in Iran that led to the 1979 Revolution? Who supported Iraq in a war against that regime five years later? Who supplied the Taliban mujahideen against the Soviet Union? Who helped overthrow former allies in Libya and Egypt and now speaks out against their successors? Who tried to arm ISIL two years ago? And so on and so forth.

>>641714
> It's used for everything

China and Russia's HUGE gas deal wasn't sealed with dollars. More countries will fend off the dollar and US will be in the shit. Which is why US intervened in Libya Khadaffi was to powerful and influential, he would've driven Africa to a gold standard and their own currency which would make them more powerful against the West. This would fuck US over though so the US grabbed the opportunity to eliminate Khadaffi.

>>641847
Way to mislead with a graph. I'm sorry you thoughti was that autistic

>>643681
>The gold standard was abandoned by the UK in 1931. Since then the UK has lost influence and power relative to the rest of the world.
Yeah, correlation=causation. It was definitely the UK moving to fiat that caused a loss of influence, not decolonization and the rise of US economic primacy.
>American living standards are about the same as with the gold standard.
The two decades after WW2 saw average real income increase fourfold. That explosive growth had to end sometime, and the end just so happened to coincide with the Vietnam War, the ending of the gold standard, and the OPEC oil crisis.