/biz/ - Business & Finance

just send them that pic in the OP lmao

>>6341954
flee the country and become a mexican elsewhere

>>6341954
I'm just going to fucking move to puerto rico and start trading. I havent made money yet mr IRS so back OFF okay?!?!?

>>6341954
I'll do it for you OP, just send me $50,000

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2018/01/11/its-going-to-be-a-nightmare-some-bitcoin-investors-are-in-for-a-rocky-tax-season/

Same thing happened to me in stocks, I took a minor loss, was too lazy to report it. Figured wtf I don't owe anything I'm only doing my self a disservice not reporting the loss. Ended up owing like 26k in taxes because 0 cost basis. There are so many retards investing in crypto that have no idea how much of an ass raping they are in for if they aren't filing properly.

>mfw I got all my money into crypto before anyone was asking for any form of ID
>localbitcoins for cash
>not gonna pay a single cent

once upon a time crypto was just fantasy internet money. what changed, gubbernment?

>what changed?

>>6341954
What did you end up doing?
And why would they send sales and not buys?

>>6341954
>signing up for an exchange with your real name

>>6341954
cointracking.info

most exchanges can either supply you a csv or even give you an API to import to your bookeeping.

The trick here is that you'll need to keep track of all deposits and withdrawals from wallets and such to get an accurate description of where fees and money is moving from.

I had over 529 trades, between 2016 and 2017. I took one weekend and tracked everything. I'm off only a little, and decided to use that as my cost basis moving forward.

Got my 2016 amended and made my estimated quarterly taxes for 2017.

or find a CPA. If this happened to you with stocks, why are you still making the same mistakes? Stop being a dumb fuck.

Everyone else can call me a dumb cuck all they want for paying taxes, but at the end of the day, I'll be white man rich, instead of nigger rich when my shit explodes beyond $200k

Best of luck to those they want to get a head.

>>6342391
And you can never use it... anything of value you'd want to buy would set of red flags, houses, cars, etc. I guess if your only plan is to buy shitty consumer goods with your money that has little life impact then by all means, you won buddy.

Also, any retard who thinks they can dodge paying short term capital gains by shifting money around different wallets and having it 'go in' as btc and come back out as btc and say I was long holding btc this entire time and not day trading.

How do you plan on explaining how your initial investment had a 1200% gain while BTC over the period you are claiming was the only asset you held had a completely different rate of return? Do you guys think at all? Oh gee this guy held X asset from Jan 3rd 2015 to Jan 3rd 2017, the market said it went up 200% but he somehow has 1000%, I guess lucky him derp derp. They will audit your ass so fast.

>>6342491
>houses
>cars

shit only a nigger would want for the short term

>all the RnD for my own blockchain-based hardware products mysteriously completed
>"yeah it was really hard we had to bootstrap for a long time and couldn't pay anyone but yeah thats the startup life kek"
>opens an offshore corp to hold everything other than the IP

>>6342638
And then what? Pay corporate tax on it, income tax? What is your end game here, all you did was just kick the can, eventually when you want to spend it, which means you are paying taxes or getting thrown in jail.

>>6342431
I refiled an amended tax return with Schedule D and 8949 filled out.
It was ScottTrade. They may also send the buys as well, but it's not the IRS's job to reconcile all your trades and calculate your PnL.

>>6342775
oh right, the final step

>wipes ass with US citizenship

bye bye muriqa, thanks for the free everything

I speak so many languages I'll make it somewhere

>>6341954
new tax law doesn't effect 2017 taxes.

What exchanges are sending the gubment the info on their accounts? That's confirmed?

>>6342973
affect

>>6342491
Laundering money isn’t hard if you do it gradually and irregularly over a long time. And you don’t tell ANYONE.

>>6342878
For one there is an exit tax, you get audited on the way out, and they make you verify that you have paid all taxes owed to IRS in past 5 years. Better hope whatever shithole you plan on staying at doesn't have extradite treaty. Not to mention when you get to your new country how in the hell you plan on just magically depositing a million dollars out of no where without setting off the same alarm bells within their governments taxation agency. They will want their cut too. No matter where you go, once you start takign delivery of that money and you aren't paying taxes on it, that country is going to think you are either up to criminal activities and start monitoring you, or think you are not reporting income and also ass rape you.

>>6343131
Ok, if you plan on fleeing a country and shit just to have an extra like 10k a year to live off of, go ahead you are pathetic. Any reasonable amount of money is going to set off alarms, anything less isn't worth all teh hassle you could have just paid the tax on it to begin with and not be a total idiot. Instead of laundering the money like a tard you could have just sold off your crypto at a pace that keeps you in the 0% capital gains tax bracket.

>>6341954
If I didn't make any crypto to crypto trades do I still have to report that I bought crypto??

>>6343386
If anyone knows the answer help a brainlet out

>>6343246
Ok how about this, since we're gonna assume the worst
>x = a way to cash out undetected
>solves for x

the gubberment isn't god, anon

>>6343386
Only when you close a position (sell) do you repor it on your taxes. Each trade is treated like it's going back to USD between them. So if you bought btc then decided to get eth it would really be. You bought btc at X, sold it for Y usd for a gain or loss. Then bought eth at Z

>>6341954
If you really made that much you should buy some property over $400k EUR in Portugal to get an investors visa, get the residency and then EU citizenship. You will not have to pay taxes to Portugal, and if you renounce to your American citizenship you will be FREE. You then can come back for periods of up to 6 months to visit your family in the US.

Seriously, move out of the country anon. Pic related, this is what waits you on the other side.

>>6341954

How cucked am I?

>>6341954
https://horizonstate.com/

and then we have a vote

[ ] - ban the IRS
[ ] - the IRS is the good guys!

>>6343485
Okay so buying crypto with cash only needs to be reported when cashing out.

All crypto to crypto are treated like a sell.

Thank you.

>>6342276
The same link with the same image was posted in a thread last night. This is a FUD/IRS Shill trying to scaremonger.

FUCK OFF

>>6343557

larp

you're still poor so you're fine
they won't tax you for a couple thousand

Meanwhile in non third-world countries there is no tax on cryptocurrency trading.

>>6343557
Dude take your 20 mil and never work another day in your life what the fuck are you doing

>>6343683
Which countries? I'm seriously considering leaving America if I ever become successful. Might as well move to a small western European country that has taxes actually benefit its productive citizens instead of the military industrial complex and millions of welfare recipients.

If anything crashes crypto markets it will be all these young turds thinking they can just not claim their gains on taxes, or try to cheat the IRS.

Then what's going to happen is there is going to be a world of hurt all over the place, MSM going to report on it left and right about all these idiots getting ass raped by IRS, everyone is going to think that investing in crypto is a sure bet for an IRS audit and want nothing to do with the market.

>>6341954
>Your crypto exchange reports your $1,000,000 of sales to the IRS after being subpoenaed
except i use binance

Not to mention people saying they will leave the country, what fucking country is going to take you? They don't want to import stupid bums who have no job prospects. If on paper you look like you are some unemployeed guy with no money why are they going to give you citizenship?

>>6343841
There are many countries where you could move. Check these articles:
https://corpocrat.com/2016/01/30/the-best-golden-visa-programs-in-europe/
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-27674135
https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/10/business/europes-having-a-distress-sale-on-visas.html

>>6343963
>https://corpocrat.com/2016/01/30/the-best-golden-visa-programs-in-europe/
Are you guys seriously this stupid, it's like the fucking chicken in the egg with you guys. How do you plan on buying some million dollar real estate if you never claimed your income? And the entire reason you are leaving the country is so you don't have to claim the income... jesus christ.

>>6343963
Investor Visa, not tax dodging retard visa. You have no money to invest into their country, you are broke on paper.

I have an idea you oldcucks
>don't pay it
Seems to have worked so far, of course if you are making big bucks that's different. But if you are making 10k or less, you are a small fry.
I'll pay $100 and say that's what i thought i owed.

Prove me wrong

>>6343386
Any time you sold any crypto you have to add a row to 8949 form.
It doesn't matter whether you sold for USD or for another crypto.

>>6343956
You can open an account on Bitstamp and some EU bank (in Liechtenstein for instance), cash out, buy a property, apply for the investors visa, get the permanent resident document and then apply for citizenship. You wouldn't believe how many people do this. There are tons for expats communities around the world.

>>6344106
Do you not realize how hard it is to open a bank account in a country you are not a resident in? Are you seriously this naive? (You can't because of reasons like you are trying to do) . There are banking treaties between countries you idiot.

>>6344097
Are you an IRS agent or some govt shill? It's literally as easy as selling your crypto in some European exchange, buy a house, and request the visa. Seriously.

>>6343617
You have to report and pay taxes on all sales.
It doesn't matter whether or not you have cashed out from the exchange to your bank.

>>6344103
If you’re not going to pay it don’t pay $100. Don’t mention crypto on your return AT ALL or they will have reason to dig deeper.

>>6344169
>Do you not realize how hard it is to open a bank account in a country you are not a resident in?
This is how I know you are either LARPing or shilling for the US government. It just takes one single Google search to disproof your stupidity.

>>6344244
>shilling for the US Gov't

Well he hasn't told us to buy ripple yet sooo

>>6342622
Ok. So just fudge five trades that would match the numbers, rather than recording hundreds or thousands.

>>6342484
Can you help me out with this? Just a 22 year old NEET who's closing in on 7 figures, trying to not get ass raped. I'll pay you handsomely.

>>6344244
"Single google search" yet doesn't bother linking the proof he found. Tell me, how do you plan on identifying yourself at this bank where you plan on having an account? Do you plan on just say hi guys my name is Tim Bobby, I was born this day haha trust me! No, you have to show them official documents, your fucking passport, us ID's and like I said, there are banking treaties that require report of deposits you numb nuts.

>>6342622
>want to dodge taxes on muh buttcoins
>determine exactly how much you're up in exactly what timeframe
>probably took you like a thousand fucking trades
>go to coinmarketcap
>find historical info
>assemble artificial trade history of two or three long term trades into shitcoins that mooned to meet exactly what % you're up
>pay nearly nothing

>>6344244
Your understanding of the world is so limited in scope, it's so childish and naive it's incredible. "I'll just open an bank account" thinking there is absolutely nothing else involved.

>>6344451
>going through this much effort to lie to the IRS

>>6344451
>>6344451
Getting thrown in federal prison for tax fraud when the exchange reports your trades and they don't match up.

>>6341954
>be nocoiner
>anticipate comfy tax season as irs diverts all resources to crypto
>I can probably get away with absolutely laughable deductions

>>6341954
christ being a burger is just depressing

>>6343841
>western european countries spend more on socialized healthcare [with 3 month waiting periods] because they don't have to pay for a military

>>6344635
because binance will totally do that

>>6342052
kekd
the pink wojak exemption

>>6343841
I live in the UK (might be easy for you to adapt since we speak the same language) and the government has stated they aren't planning to change any tax laws for cryptocurrency until at least 2018.

It's outside the scope for VAT here, so it's tax free unless you are a business which accepts crypto for goods and services.

>buy monero $1k at a time from local people in cash exchange
>send monero to unverified binance and cryptopia accounts
>only connect through a vpn
>never plan on cashing out back to cuckbuxx. if i need money i'll sell it online for cash
get fucked

>>6344859
2019* my mistake

>>6344808
People in china have a capital gains tax as well, you don't think the chinese government is going to pressure binance into releasing trade information? They want their tax too. It's a very risk game to be playing.

>>6343539
Thanks anon. I’m shopping around for other countries and will look further. The new crypto taxes here are a disaster. It’s like they want everyone to be thrown in jail over their own incompetence... or maybe they do want that because they’re that corrupt. What a mess of a system.

Thing is the IRS has the best hand for crashing the crypto market right now.

Because the market went up like 10x in valuation and they want real money for their taxes they could sifon out all the fiat available on the exchabges just for taxes.

This is not like stocks where all sticks are bought for fiat. This is a situation where they put a dollar value on your trades and you cant even buy these assets for fiat...

I made like 3k before the 31st of December. Is this shit really going to be bothered with?

Everyone who thinks crypto investing is somehow special or unique is wrong. It's no different then the forex markets. Paying capitals gains on crypto isn't some 'new' taxation, it's the same tax everyone has paid forever. You guys are just butthurt babies who are experiencing having to pay it for the first time in your lives, and having some weird criminal movie style fantasy of how you are going to flee the country and all this other bullshit. I just hope nobody actually buys into this shit, or someone takes any of the terrible advice and ruins their lives.

>>6345144
realistically? No
Are you an anxious fuck who doesn't want to worry about it and plans to keep doing crypto shit? Pay taxes

Most of the countries have capital gains tax due once the asset is sold for fiat and held in fiat on years end...
Treating each alt crypto/alt crypto as taxable events while they cant even be bought for crypto directly is a horrible for the market!

Cant wait for decentralised exchaneges to grow big in volume!

>>6345298
>decentralised exchaneges
imagine.. open source and where all transfers, trades, balances, etc, are completely hidden and irretrievable

>>6345019
China is keeping a firm hand on this bitcoin shit.

>>6343557
About as cucked as any larper

>>6345391
>you suddenly cash out 100k into your bank
>IRS wants to know where it came from
>you have no answer after it gets lost in the hidden exchange
Ya thats not going to end well

>>6345449
you dumb fuckers and your "cash out" meme. you dumber fuckers and your "put it in the bank" meme. top fucking cuck

>>6345268
No anon. I’m pissed about the way they want to tax crypto not that I have to pay taxes in general.

>>6342052
haha holy shit
>>6341954
im not filing and if they wont audit me as im too small of a fish

>>6345496
>actually wanting crypto currency for anything other than making dollars

That's literally the only actual use you tard

If i only made $10000 from crypto and I'm unemployed do I stillness pay taxes? This is my only income

>>6345391
Problem with people being able to hide their transactions more and more like this is, you are REQUIRING the government to become more and more involved into your personal spending.

If you think the government is going to just shrug and say oh well I guess we can't tax that money you are wrong. So now instead of having a nice system where we have a trusted centralized exchange that reports the activity, and the government believes it. The government has to analyze peoples spending habits based on their reported incomes to determine whether they are properly reporting incomes or not.

This sort of thing is going to force the IRS to become more and more invasive into our lives out of necessity to properly collect it's revenue. I don't think people really realize that aspect of it. All this fantasy of privacy is a joke, all it's doing is becoming a catalyst for more Big Brother government 1984 style.

>>6345498
it makes 100% sense the way they want to tax it. Crypto isn't currency as much as you want to think it is

>>6344859
Would I be able to immigrate easily if I have a law degree from a prestigious American University? (Top 15 in the country for Law) Also planning on learning french, because my dream is Swiss/Belgian citizenship.

>>6345660
You have to go back. Get the rope once you’re there, too.

>>6345555
>cuckbucks
literally and unironically no thanks. checkin those quads tho

>>6342391
localbitcoins is a fed honeypot read the fucking articles
>what changed
they want complete control over our lives
>>6342491
>And you can never use it
This is why XMR is going to moon

>>6343246
by the time this situation arises the entire system will be ran on a blockchain with crypto

>>6343019
coinbase is suing the IRS because the IRS is requesting login, location, trade, bank etc info for every account

>>6346080
>coinbase
call me when the chinks submit to the irs oh wait i still won't give a shit because i did all my trading in unverified account and stash the gains i want to keep in monero.

>>6346231
--through a vpn

Take them to court over the claim that crypto is a capital asset. I think you could contest that.

>>6345391
Actually... you can retrieve transactions.

https://deltabalances.github.io

>>6346356
i said monero you illiterate nigger

>>6346489
And what do you plan on buying with your monero? You guys all actually think it's the future and you can buy shit with your crypto coins, it's never going to happen. You will have to transfer it to fiat and pay tax when you do to buy something. The government will see Monero to USD, assume your cost basis is 0 unless you prove otherwise. Enjoy your fantasy.

>>6346678
>You guys all actually think it's the future and you can buy shit with your crypto coins, it's never going to happen
:^)

I wouldn't be surprised if governments are just letting this go on because they see it as a new revenue stream. Letting retards take money that would have normally been spent, sit in savings, or I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of it is from credit card debt. Slap it all around the crypto market day trading and wracking up a huge short term cap gains bill.

>>6342484
I already have a head but thanks anyways.

>>6341954
>have to file one additional form
>NIGHTMAAAARE!
kek

>>6341954
>mfw I had to hire a cpa and pay him an assload just to file my shitcoin trades in 2017.

what a timeline we live on

>>6345583
yes

>>6346678
>You guys all actually think it's the future
are you saying that planning for the future is bad?nigger detected

>>6341954
>Something like this happened to me the first year I traded stocks.
Ahaha what kind of fly-by-night bullshit brokerage were you using that they don't give you a complete report that their computer spat out for them in February? Besides the odd PTP, I don't have to individually report shit because it just goes straight from my broker's computer to the IRS.

>>6343838
This wtf that's a 200k salary for 100 years lmao you made it already bro

>>6347102
You will never be able to pay for goods with your crypto currency main stream without it being reported to government. Any transaction network that will eventually replace VISA will have to be compliant to ensure business are reporting their profits properly. If you don't play by the governments rules they will step in and shut it all down. Don't be a naive child.

>>6347111
Fidelity, this was like 10 years ago. And yes they do send it to the IRS, but as another anon mentioned the IRS assumes your cost basis to be 0 if you don't file it yourself.

>>6344859
Don't we still have to pay capital gains on profits exceeding something like £11k?

>>6347030
how much?

>>6347280
>You will never be able to pay for goods with your crypto currency main stream without it being reported to government. Any transaction network that will eventually replace VISA will have to be compliant to ensure business are reporting their profits properly. If you don't play by the governments rules they will step in and shut it all down. Don't be a naive child.
lmao

>>6347102
Read all of that *phew*

Black people make so much more sense now.

>>6347590
Please, tell me about your happy fun land future. Where all transactions and deposits are completely untraceable. And how the government just says hey everyone that's OK because we TRUST you! Just tell us how much money you made and give us what you think is fair. "lmao" please do go on.

>>6344377
>Can you help me out with this?
Not the guy you're replying to, but look at form 8949 that the OP posted. The IRS doesn't need all the data on this exact form, they really only care about the data and being able to read it. Open up an excel file and replicate the columns on that table. Capture the data each time you trade. Put a header on that file with your name, ssn, and a title like "Attachment A" or "Attachment 1" or whatever you feel like calling it. On the actual form 8949, fill out the top part, then write "See Attachment A" (or whatever you called it) and then just put down your grand totals for basis, proceeds, and net gains. Note that you also need to fill out Schedule D, but that's a no-brainer.

>>6342228
You can get a mansion near the beach in Puerto Rico for $300k. Someone explain to me right now why I shouldn't do it using an argument that doesn't involve racism.

>>6347280
>this was like 10 years ago
Ah, roger. I forget that not everybody here is younger than me.

>>6347889
hurricane=bye bye mansion in >5years

>>6347889
enjoy having that mansion get rekt by hurricanes every year.

Also that island is still like 70% no electricity after the last storm

Cash out to Monero

'Lose wallet'

3 months later

Buy a hard drive at a 'garage sale'

Oh look just found a wallet with a shit load of monero on it, lucky you.

It's fucking simple you brainlets
>Bought X amount of crypto at Y1 price
Now I have it at Y2 price
Y2 - Y1 = taxable amount. Unless you're moving loads of money you can just give that basic amount and the IRS won't be bothered checking every single trade you made.

>>6347777
please don't call them people

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/268806252_Inferring_Human_Phylogenies_Using_Three_CODIS_STR_Markers_CSF1PO_TPOX_and_TH01

>>6347579
800 bucks. last year it was like 400.

>>6348057
you pay capital gains on the difference between what you paid for the hard drive and the value of the monero when you exchange it for fiat

>>6343956
>>6343485
>>6343307
>>6343246
>>6342775
This faggot sure is desperate to fearmonger.

I know this is the shit I'm going to have to deal with

>>6342380
fuck amurica m8 we donta have thisa much problemas heere in europa!! tu me comprends? Amerikaņū idīots

>>6347111
>Ahaha what kind of fly-by-night bullshit brokerage were you using that they don't give you a complete report that their computer spat out for them in February? Besides the odd PTP, I don't have to individually report shit because it just goes straight from my broker's computer to the IRS.
He's larping

>>6347889
It's a shithole

>>6347889
naggers

>>6347889
>using an argument that doesn't involve racism.
you have to live around niggers. welcome to the real world, reddit

>>6348103

Okay then.

https://www.saltlending.com/

Put up X amount of Crypto for a X loan.

Default on the loan.

You keep the money SALT keeps the crypto

Feels good being Dutch and not dealing with any of this crap

So if I buy a rare magic card and sell it at a convention with 100 other card trades and buys /sells are all a taxable event?

Dumb

BTW, spaniard here. I've read in some webpages that cryptos are taxed 19/21/23% (€0<€50,000<Lamboland) using FIFO to calculate. I thought this was robbery until I read about the burgers and germans

>>6348570
you can pay a set amount of USD for WoW gold. you can sell WoW items for USD. if i farm WoW gold and give it to someone for some stupid item then is that a taxable event?

>>6348408
Checkmate

>>6341954
Yea so? That's fucking 8 hours of paperwork. Try not to hurt yourself.

How do you guys report scam coins on your tax form?

Long story short, I fell for the GOLDC scam last year. I lost $200. I've already made that money back, but it's all in coins that I haven't cashed out yet.

1. Do I still report that? CAN I report that? Where do I even get proof of this loss?
2. Since taxes only come from when you exchange crypto to crypto or crypto to USD and I haven't cashed anything out yet, I'm only taxed for when I bought crypto for crypto, and the amount I lost on GOLDC is greater than the gains on my crypto. Does the loss on GOLDC offset those gains?
3. If I have any loss leftover, can I use the loss from GOLDC to lessen any potential wage taxes I have?

Something tells me whichever countries have the most lax laws towards crypto are going to be doing very very well these next coming years.

Go up the stairs to your parents. Explain that you didn't get the education to know what you are doing. Then tell them to accompany to the IRS building tomorrow and give yourself in. Its your only CHANCE.

How do you guys report scam coins on your tax form?

Long story short, I fell for the GOLDC scam last year. I lost $200. I've already made that money back, but it's all in coins that I haven't cashed out yet.

1. Do I still report that? CAN I report that? Where do I even get proof of this loss?
2. Since taxes only come from when you exchange crypto to crypto or crypto to USD and I haven't cashed anything out yet, I'm only taxed for when I bought crypto for crypto, and the amount I lost on GOLDC is greater than the small gains I made on BTC/ETH before I traded it for crypto. Does the loss on GOLDC offset those gains?
3. If I have any loss leftover, can I use the loss from GOLDC to lessen any potential wage taxes I have?

>>6348265
Don't lie. EU tax offices are already asking all crypto sellers to fill out extended forms what they are selling and doing. Since they believe they have a legal and right business, they will sell you out.

>>6348949
You mean Singapore, also the host of coss.io

>>6348600
If you keep it one year and didn't touch it (like a painting at the wall), then you pay zilch in germany. Because cryptos are yet not currency nor stocks. But this might end 2019

>>6348562
>1st world country
>weed is legal
>tallest country in the world
lucky bastard. I unironically wish I was you, and I'm not a cuck. Fuck you

>>6348991
You would need to claim the capital loss this year, capital losses carry over year to year so you can use it to offset a future capital gain. Capital losses can't offset payroll income tax, only capital gains.

yawn. decentralized dex, chinese exchanges, no accounts verified, cashing out in person, using casino to wash, yeah im sure the big bad government which is completely incompetent at everything in life is going to be able to follow that

>>6349117
"Limit on Losses. If your capital losses are more than your capital gains, you can deduct the difference as a loss on your tax return. This loss is limited to $3,000 per year, or $1,500 if you are married and file a separate return."

Did I misread that? It says I can use up to $3000 of a capital loss as a deduction on income tax.

>>6349204
There are people in EU who swap BTC with 10% off in goldcoins and got them via mail from Ukraine. This way they need only like 100 packages to get their 50k balance cleared, with the option that the Ukrainians suddenly "forget" that you still have to receive goldcoins.

>>6349204
yeah you're smart but some of us (me) are dumb enough to see BTC and be like holy shit I can make moneys from this and sign up ASAP with their real name, making it impossible to tax evade. In other words I'm like a normie but a virgin retard

>>6349101
Yeah, I bet once you manage to keep it one year, they would've already changed the laws, because someone needs to feed those refugee doctors

>>6349290
Eh, maybe you can. I'm no accountant just going based off my personal experience. If that's the case you will have to judge whether it makes sense to offset cap gains in future vs income now (which one has a higher tax rate for you)

>>6341954
Really though, the exchanges send your records, not just your sales. The IRS will know if you tried to hide money or if you didn't made/lost anything.

>>6349426
I owe about $400 in taxes due to my employer erroneously putting my exemptions too high, so I can use the full remaining amount now.

What I asked though is HOW do I report it as a loss. The IRS is going to want to see proof that GOLDC died. I can provide proof that I paid for the GOLDC, but I can't provide proof that GOLDC is dead. A "dead website" won't be enough proof, will it?

Usually, old accounts get grandfathered. And every country wants a taste, no just the Krauts.US IRS sees it as income like everything else.

Jesus the amount of idiocy in this thread. It’s like you forget what fucking /crypto/ even IS. It’s your chance to reclaim the power over your own damn money. So take it!

First of all what you have to ask yourself is, if you do indeed want to participate in the old-world fiatbux circus, are the taxes imposed by your government morally justified?

For example, I, in the US, believe the current tax scheme is unfair. I don’t want to pay 40% when I cash out. If the reason for the high tax is because of the ethical implications of making “too easy money” from the recent bull market, I’d want to explore that further and hear other people’s opinions on it, but right now it’s apparent to me that the government doesn’t know what to do yet so they’re just overreaching in the meantime, discouraging any Americans’ wild fantasies of gaming the system and getting rich off fake internet money.

In which case, I’m holding on to my coins, and possibly starting to increase my frequency of tumbling them into my monero stack.

If you don’t want to deal with the current tax situation....then don’t. You have 2 options, go somewhere else, or stand up & fight for what you believe is right. That’s how the revolutionary war started you niggers, remember? Are you going to be a man and step up? Or will you be so sad that crypto can’t be a get rich quick scheme for you that you just give up? Your call.

>>6349693
I don't agree with rape laws either, so I don't have to obey them... come here boy.

>>6349693
It all comes down to an issue of power. If you're rich, you can hire powerful lawyers to fight the IRS and eventually win after a 5+ year battle due to taxes being against the law. However, 99% of wagecucks can't do anything since the IRS is just too powerful and said 99% of wagecucks will just pay their taxes either to "be moral" or "in fear of going to prison/facing huge fees."

>>6341954
Wow I hate the IRS now

>>6342445
tf. how would u ever make money without verification?

>>6349802
>false analogy
try again, sweetie

if your dealership doesnt accept bitcoin wtf are you doing

if your college doesnt accept bitcoin wtf are you doing


if your realator doesnt accept bitcoin wtf are you doing

Let's just say I do all my trading on Chinese exchanges.

>make 100k
>cash out
>tell IRS it was all on one trade.

What could realistically go wrong?

>>6341954
bitcoin.tax

Pay the $19.95 or w/e

Import all yo shit

Schedule D and 8949 auto printed

Oh and you can play with fifo or lifo to get the best result.

idiots.

>>6349902
>For example, I, in the US, believe the current tax scheme is unfair. I don’t want to pay 40% when I cash out.

You believe that, not everyone in the country agrees it's unfair. There is no false analogy, you are just an arrogant retard with a god complex who thinks he's above the law because your moral opinion should be the law of the land.

I wouldnt mind paying 250,000$ if I made 1,000,000

I would mind paying 250,000$ if I made 1,000,000

>>6350191
>the law is always right

>>6350486
>can't even cut an image correctly
fuck off pajeet

>>6341954

Or you could just pay when you cash out. What the fuck are they realistically going to do if you move it between all these coins? Nothing.

>>6350337
>I'm going to complain about laws, but never lift a finger to improve them. Just going to be a criminal instead.

>>6350191
>this nocoiner so desperate to cope

*moves everything to XMR*
*deletes all exchange accounts*
*moves to a country with no CGT for a few months*
*cashes out*

Pssshhh nothing personell, tax agencies...

>>6349805
Ok, of course. But again.....missing the entire fucking point of decentralized currency.

You don’t have to be one rich guy to get what you want. You have in your hands part of a revolution in the making. Use it for good and for glory.

Start a movement, clearly there are others like you, evidenced by this very thread, who don’t agree with the present way things are. Fix it! This is what crypto IS ALL ABOUT.

>>6349908
Also, this. Wherever you usually go to spend money, ask them if they accept crypto. If not, ask why the fuck not. Convince them to (lower fees? Less regulatory bureaucracy BS? Having the X factor of being a hip business that takes cool new payment options if nothing else at all?); if you can’t, find someone else to take your money; if you can’t, for fuck’s sake, take the opportunity into your own hands and use it to bridge the obvious open void in the market by starting a venture yourself that does fill that need, and run them out of business.

>>6348570
>>6348635
this if I get a rare TF2 item and sell it for 20,000 do I have to pay tax on that

>>6345268
you stubborn motherfucker, you just won't fuck off, will you?

What if I pump everything through monero then sell it for btc on an unverified exchange, then move my btc back and forth between my own wallets and claim that I mined them years ago with no records?
what are they gonna do?

What If I do the same but instead of claiming mining I claim it's all fan donations from yt/blog/etc?

What if I put up some fake trades that add up?
how are they gonna verify that? even if binance leeks everything, there is no name attached to my account? and good luck searching through billions of all binance transactions

If you're still so stubborn
What if I do the same but for an exchange that doesn't exist anymore?
how will good 'ol IRS check that?

What if I simply gift all my crypto to some of family members?

What are they gonna do to people who simply have no records? are the gonna blame all of them for Money laundering/drug dealing and disallow them to ever cash out?

How are you gonna report all your fucking forks/icos?

What if you don't have any funds to pay taxes because you're all in crypto?
inb4 hurr cash out a chunk
well now I cashed out what I would originally owe for taxes, but now actually I made less than the amount I antcipated by cashing out that portion for tax purposes
I think there is even a name for that
>double dipping

and there is thousands of other scenarios that your ass won't be able to answer

>>6343841
Puerto Rico has no capital gains tax and you only have to be a resident for six months and then I sign a deal with the tax man. Boom problem solved losers move to PR

Just

>>6347889
Just learn to speak ultra fast F1 speed Spanish and live among us sub human Puerto ricans for 6 months and all your capital gains can be legally untaxed and the IRS can go fuck itself

>During 2017 your sales of all cryptocurrencies is $1,000,000. ($50,000 x 20 dumps)

That's not how it works, retard.You pay capital gains on PROFIT not revenue. This whole thread is fud.

>>6342276
nice wojack

>>6348103
Or simply send your coins to a hardware wallet and claim you were hacked. Trade hardware wallet to someone you trust for cash.

>>6352226
Actually in 2018 every sale is a taxable event. Trump fucked it up

I was just going to put what I initially bought and what I ended up with. Will I get fucked doing that?

Pro-tip - you don't really have to move anywhere. You just have to go abroad to cash in. Even better - you register a company abroad and all the trading goes under it's name.

>>6341954
It would be more like 33-35%. Just use bitcoin.tax you mongoloid. Then you won't pay anything. wa-la.

>>6343246
you must be stupid, OF COURSE YOU DONT CASH OUT WHILE IN THE US

When you get that St Kitts citizenship, THEN you do it...

>>6352226
Also what entity would turn your shit in besides goynbase?
>>6341954
Also pics of IRS paperwork stating they're investigating you or it didn't happen.

>>6348181
>>6352706
You guys are retarded. He's completely right, and your only counter argument is shoving your fingers into your ears.
Gonna get raped by the IRS, anons.

>>6352411
Use that money to buy lambo, IRS wonders how you can afford a lambo when you lost your monero

>>6347889
Puerto Rico is fucking beautiful. My father did this exact thing recently. Get a nice apartment in Condado or in on of the gated communities nearby. There is a small community of whites doing the same thing. The food is FUCKING FANTASTIC in practically every restuarant, and i highly recommend taking up kitesurfing as a hobby. It is kind of like an islandy new york. Power outages and sometimes even water outages can be common however, and the internet is not too great. It is a bohemian trader's lifestyle and I highly reccomend it.

Threadly reminder

>https://bitcoin.tax/

I'm fine as long as I don't sell though right? Just buy and sit on it.

>>6352845
You take a loan, open a small art gallery and "sell" your feces for $100,000 pro chunk and get a tax reduction.

Come on, art is money laundering 101.

>>6352823
US tax law only apply to US residents. If you report yourself as a foreign resident, even if you're US citizen, IRS can't touch you. And the best thing is, you don't even have to actually live abroad to be a foreign resident, you just can't have a job in US.

>>6353064
Yeah but you have to be established first. Might as well start a dry cleaner company

>>6352845
Wonder why niggers buy $500 piece of shit cars and trick them out? It's so when the cops show up and ask how they have $10k into car you can claim you just spend a little bit each check for it.

>TL;DR chimps are more intelligent than you.

>>6345583
You are supposed to fill out a 1040.
You are supposed to calculate all this PnL and report it as income.
But the standard deduction ($6300) and the 1-persion exemption ($4050) will be subtracted from your income, so you won't owe anything in the end.
I'm not a tax professional so this might be wrong. Don't listen to me.

>>6353064
Cash transaction over 10k is reportable to IRS, part of money laundering laws go figure. You guys really need to learn tax laws if you want to be big boys playing with money.

All these people thinking they will not pay taxes are in for an ass raping. They will catch you and when they do they will audit you for 5 years back you can bet your ass on it. Keep thinking you young dumb shits are smarter than the IRS.

>>6353146
>US tax law only apply to US residents.
Does your mom still wipe your ass? Literally the entire world, minus you, know that the US taxes all US citizens, regardless of residence. You are so dumb the world needs you to kys

>>6353176
Spend 10.5k on car over the course of a few years. Have over a million in USD. Thinks spending 10.5k means shit.

You're losing your money to inflation good job on trying to call me a nigger when you can't think in percentages.

>>6341954
when are crypto taxes for 2017 due if you live in clapistan?

>>6352934
Please.

>>6353269
Whatever you say old cuck. Like they are really gonna know every transaction I made on binance a chink trade. And they are gonna expect tax payment on every fucking trade I do which is like 15 daily. I'm gonna keep my money invested and pull out a couple grand when I need it. On that couple grand I will pay like 5 percent and no one will say shit.

>>6348281
It was ScottTrade in around 2003.

>>6348062
This.
Simple

>>6343557
you just ruined your blockfolio history

>>6348831
Add in cross-crypto trades.
Add in uneven buy and sell amounts and a whole range of prices over time.
Add in forks.
Also, does the 30 day "wash sale" rule apply to crypto?
This will be harder for some people depending on how messy their trading history has been.
Also, there are some brainlets who have been trading crypto...

>>6348991
>3. If I have any loss leftover, can I use the loss from GOLDC to lessen any potential wage taxes I have?
Up to about $4000 per year. Then you carry over the balance to next year to offset against trading gains in that year.

>>6349117
>Capital losses can't offset payroll income tax
They do up to a small amount.
I think it is around $4000.

>>6349445
The IRS doesn't match up your buys and sells.
That's your job to do with form 8949.
If you don't do it, they assume zero cost and fuck you.

>>6341954
Did you get hit with penalties after correcting it?

>>6349503
"I lost all my gold in a boating accident." is a well-worn meme.

Our president is one of the most infamous tax evaders in history, taxation is theft and illegal according to the actual law so how is there no way actually do this?

>>6349693
Most people who poured into crypto in 2017 are not principled libertarians like you.
They are trand-followers trying to get rich quick without thinking about the tax question until April 15.

So let's get this shit straight.
You play an MMO called Cryptocurrency and you spent $1000 in the in-game shop because you want that pay-to-win lifestyle.
You keep playing this game and you killed fuck ton of mini bosses and took loots.
In one year, your net worth becomes $100,000.
But anons, my time spent on this game and its game currency I earned are all pixels! As long as I don't cash out into some financial institution, it was all just a game.
Side note: the game items and its currency have value only if there was at least one underground market putting price tags on it

>>6354091
The funny part is, the brainlets will be the ones getting ass raped by IRS for trying to cover up their shit tier gains. Gotta save my 500 bucks!

>>6341954
I Screenshot OPs images.
Sending to irs as my last page when I cash out

>>6351327

>>6354618
Much revolution

>>6341954
Don't know American tax laws and you can't math.

>>6352226
>You pay capital gains on PROFIT not revenue.
Of course you pay capital gains on profits, not revenue.
But you have to fill out the 8949 and submit it to the IRS, or the IRS will assume a cost basis of zero and consider your revenue as all profit.

It's not the job of the IRS to reconcile all your trades and subtract costs from revenue to figure out your profit. That's your job when you fill out the 8949. If you don't do it, then they assume "zero basis" or "no cost" and all your revenue (sales) are considered profit.

I receive a letter from the IRS to this effect in 2003.
Other posters in this thread have mentioned the same thing happening to them.

>>6352503
That's not what you are supposed to do.
Depends on how much your profit is.
Is it worth it to the IRS to audit you?

>>6343307
I like you for trying to educate faggots. I hate you because you appear to be a faggot that is educating faggots with bad info.

Unless you are talking about long term capital gains tax. There is no 0% income tax bracket. Maybe after deductions and whatnot it will be 0%, but if you can live off of ~9k a year kudos. And you better not have another job, because that will bump you up into another tax bracket.

Short term capital gains is based on income tax bracket. Long term is something like a flat 0-20% based on tax bracket. I believe the bottom 2 brackets don’t pay long term capital gains tax.

Canuck here, will I be okay if I just pay capital gains on the total amount I cashed out?

>>6352822
>Also pics of IRS paperwork stating they're investigating you or it didn't happen.
It was from around 2003. I don't think I have it anymore. The broker was ScottTrade.

>>6355131
Same happened to me, why would he still have it? Also it's not an investigation or audit, it's a bill. It's just a letter saying you owe us x amount, for me it was 24k. You then have to amend your return, then they are like ok you don't owe us anything after all.

>>6347790
You STILL dont get it. CRYPTO IS A REVOLUTION AGAINST THE GOVERNMENT-BANKING COMPLEX

Do you REALLY think Obfuscation is just there to be a cool feature? That Monero is just there to bw some random anon coin?

NO

We're already halfway there. With currencies like Monero, its basically untraceable. The government cant keep up. They are literally too slow for the speed of crypto developers.

Man, dont you get it - the writing is on the wall. Once the Decentralized exchanges come, along with the Anon Atomic swaps, all its gonna take is for vendors to start adopting crypto. All its gonna take is mass adoption, and thats coming faster than you think.

The Federal Reserve and the USD Is a dead man walking. The normie invasion has already begun. Good Riddance! You dont see the big picture.

Crypto is the beginning of the end of the Zionist Empire. We are the the BEGINNING of the revolution.

Most people around here dont realize it yet. Some do because they are from pol. We are, right now, in a PRE-Revolutionary state. Socially, politically, economically, everything is in collapse. It's do or die.

Why do you think Private send/Darksend/Darkmix is out there. Its not just a cool fucking feature you doofus. The WAR IS ON. It's already started.

>>6353340
>literally only thinks about spending money on a car
You're going to be broke. You don't realize the cost of maintenance and insurance on the car.
You also missed my point don't buy big buy a bunch of little shit if you want to stay under the radar. IRS isn't going to think twice when you own a viper. Pay a place like Hennessey to soup it up and you can have a car that is just as fast as a lambo without it looking like you spent a beyond your means.

>>6354147
other poster says it's $3000

>>6354288
No. I filed it right away.
Also, I actually got a check back after refiling, since I had a net loss on my trading for that year. I had overpaid my tax on the original. I was able to reduce my income by about $1500 after refiling. (There is a $3000 limit to offsetting trading losses against wage income.)

>>6353340
>literally only thinks about spending money on a car
You're going to be broke. You don't realize the cost of maintenance and insurance on the car.
You also missed my point don't buy big buy a bunch of little shit if you want to stay under the radar. IRS isn't going to think twice when you own a viper. Pay a place like Hennessey to soup it up and you can have a car that is just as fast as a lambo without it looking like you spent a beyond your means.

>>6355414
Quantum computing. Enjoy the ass raping.

>>6355414
Honestly, this. So many people are blinded by the profits of crypto, but they dont realize that the whole economy is fake to begin with since USD is fiat propped up by banks. Crypto is the beginning of the revolution against our Zionist overlords. The thing is this - if we can free ourselves economically from Zionist control, then we can start organizing a real resistance.

Also, the new Darknet (Like Shift, Substratum, ODN, etc) will allow clear, anonymous channels, clear of any sort of government censorship. This is the real build out of an infrastructure for a revolution in 2019. A revolution that will be fought in the digital world first.

>>6341954
>tax
>paper form
tax has been an online app for like 10 years now, grandpa.

>>6355648
>Thinking that Quantum computing hasnt been thought of yet
Man, you're in for a surprise.

>>6355771
I worked at NSA for 4 years as Software Engineer, I'm not in for any surprise. Enjoy the ass raping naive child.

good thing I live in Switzerland where if I don't file a tax report they will just assume that I didn't earn shit last year and send me an invoice for 200$ because they think I earned 10k last year.

>>6355912
What is your obsession with ass rape?

>>6355912
And I worked for 6 years as a Software Architect for the DEA before I quit due to the rampant corruption within the divisions. You're in for a big surprise, kiddo. I've been in crypto since 2012. Nothing lasts forever, including the American Empire. It's toast.

>>6355363
OK, these guys made me go back in look in my old files. It's from 2006 and it was ETRADE, not ScottTrade.
The form I got from the IRS was called a CP-2000 Notice.

It lists every sale I did not report.

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/understanding-your-cp2000-notice

>>6354091

yea like I said thats 8 hours of paperwork. Brainlets get fucked. Brainlets probably arent making enough money for the irs to bother with them anyways.

Newsflash, the IRS does a cost analysis on whether it is profitable to audit you or if they would be spending more money then they would recieve. They're not coming after some brainlet with 500 bucks crypto profit.

>>6356144
"In crypto since 2012" yet thinks crypto can't be broken top kek friend

What if someone steals my account, do I still have to pay even though I have nothing

>>6352860
(((whites)))

>>6356337
You would need to file a police report and give them all your account info so they can investigate the crime. Have fun with that.

>>6355363
>>6355131
Sorry I assumed you were much younger since most of this board still are at an age where mom and dad have yet to kick them out.

Also you're supposed to keep all tax forms for 6-8 years just in case the IRS decides to audit you. Having a large income or a large amount of deductions is a red flag.

>>6356259
You're a fool. The shit that is coming out is leagues ahead of anything the divisions can produce. The government is inherently slow, you would know this if you really worked at the NSA. It's laughable to think that the government will have any chance if the masses actually adopt crypto.

The government with their endless office drones, fiddling around, literally jerking off at their PC's (I've seen some shit) cant compete with this new generation of hackers and software engineers. You mention Quantum Computing, and yet coin projects have already been launched (Like Quantum Ledger) addressing the issue, even if its not technically built yet - the awareness is certainly here.

They cannot compete with this new generation of engineers. Collaboration is done from home, on the net, in Discord, soon to be anonymous platforms like ODN, developers can come together and build out testnets like none other. 24/7, 7 days a week, you have hardcore programmers coding some serious shit. The NSA, DEA, FBI - can't compete. They just cant.

>>6356419


>be me
> put 50k USD into crypto
> account gets hacked
> lose everything
> file police report
> they're too busy writing tickets and shooting niggers
> case unsolvable, sorry anon
> write off 50k loss on taxes
> grow old and die before I can actually use my crypto to buy anything

>>6356358
A good chunk of puerto ricans are like the whitest latin people out there. They literally look like white people, you can only tell them apart by them speaking.

>>6341954
>AHHH tax form
Fuck, my sides.

Okay, so I've finally gotten cointracking to correctly calculate my EOY balances in the tax report by manually changing all margin-borrowing fee transactions from "WITHDRAWAL" to "SELL" transaction type.

BUT, those transactions don't show up on the gains report as losses. They should, right? I mean, the fees are subtracted from my coinpurse, so it should at least be counted as a loss based on the cost-basis of the coins taken by the fee, shouldn't it? How do I make this shitty web program add them up right?

Has anyone who's done margin trading been able to figure this stuff out on Cointracking?