/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>55891687
Bitcoin is not dead, just completely useless in the real world, and with a completely horrifying risk-reward ratio as an investment.

Also, the fag from the twitter screenshot was a prominent small blocker.
6 years ago is exactly when small blockers won, destroying bitcoin.
This clueless faggot probably sees external forces as the demise of bitcoin, rather than his own greed and stupidity.

Small blockers ruined bitcoin and destroyed all of the true value it held.
The did it out of stupidity and greed.
Ironically, they remained the only people in crypto who couldn't make it.
Bitcoin Cashies were introduced to Avalanche before the ICO, and ended up buying 50k each at $0.33, or at worst, $0.50. They also received thousands of AVAXies as an airdrop for being early, running a test node, etc.
METHheads saw their coin rise 400000% with high volume.
Even shitcoiners got rich through absolute shitcoins.
Only corekeks watched their beloved investment barely beat inflation for 6 years, with huge dips inbetween.
And they did it out of GREED of all things.
Karma is a bitch.

Oh also BSV pajeets and people stupid enough to trust BSV pajeetery on this board also didn't make it, but once again that's the least of what they deserve for being so stupid and obnoxious.

>>55891687
bitcoin is digital gold, no need for update, gold hasn't changed in 3000 years.

>>55892420
>bitcoin is digital gold
Let me fix this for you, anon

>>55892411
meds

>b-but you can't even play heckin pacman on-chain!
BTC is Money, shitcoiner. Trustless, stateless, counterparty-free, no carrying cost Money. Hyperbitcoinization has already begun.

Kaspa fixes this.

>>55892419
You complain about small blocks and then shit on BSV? BSV is what Bitcoin was always supposed to be

>>55892428
Cope harder faggot, you ruined crypto hoping to make more money off it, and literally everyone else outperformed you.
The average hp0s buyer made more gains last week than you made in the six years after you destroyed bitcoin.
>>55892456
Money can be used as cash. BTC is a ponzi-like scheme, with high risk and low reward.
>>55892527
BSV will literally disappear if someone cuts Calvin's power supply you dumbass.
That's not what bitcoin was always supposed to be.
Enjoy your reorgs on your weather data chain.

>>55892348
exactly. basically everyone who invested lost money

>>55891687
>Bitcoin hasn't been corrupted in 6 years and that's BAD

Lmao, shitcoiners, literally.

>>55891687
not that Bitcoin isn't obsolete for several precise reasons, but this FUD is dumb. A protocol is not supposed to evolve once "final". Do you expect changes for TCP IP? No

>>55891687
A good coin doesn't need constant development, and having a team "developing" a coin implies centralisation. Ideally a coin should be launched fairly on good fundamentals and then changed little after that.

>>55892425
L M A O

>listening to late adopter rat kikes
if you think anything survives in this market without bitcoin you don't understand this market
but go ahead, keep being my exit liquidity like you were in 2021

I felt iffy making a buy order at $26k so I cancelled it.
Feels pretty good. I'll pick it up at $22k.

>>55892420
What about gold changed 3000 years ago?

>>55892527
because these mind-broken retards have no idea what they're even hallucinating about. not a single one of them can explain to you how the actual cryptography of something like bitcoin works, for example, the simplest part of it.

>>55892600
-m2-
1970: $0.5T
1980: $1.5T
2000: $4.5T
2020: $15T
2023 $20.8T

I can send the equivalent of $1b USD across the world in 10mins for less than the cost of a mcdouble 24/7 without counterparty risk, I can also stash it in a cold wallet and it will never be confiscated, debased, or liquidated.

1) BTC only needs capitalization for ascension
2) BTC is an even better liquidity sponge then gigacap tranny tech
3) They can't kill BTC without killing their own grift

These are the facts. Stop wasting time playing their game, stop contributing to their system, the only way forward is through.

>>55892783
the little brown rat is out there shilling compromised custodian solutions, desperately trying to sell now completely failed nfts, incessantly shilling his tragic newsletter with zero insight. you could argue being wrong for engagement makes sense but he's been wrong every step of the way and hasn't grown in years.

>>55892823
discoveries that circulating supply may actually be exponential over time

>>55892838
Based knower.

>>55892425
Peak shitcoiner coping and seething

Alt coin baggies predictably lashing out

>>55892889
All shitcoins will go to zero. But Monero will be exception to the rule. This is fate

>>55892926
Doesn't Monero have an unlimited supply?
Hard pass, bro.

>>55891687
Maybe because the Blackrock guy was shilling it the other day? I'll believe him when he throws at least 10% of Blackrock's money at it. Other than that, he's just a man wanting everyone else to lose their money.

>>55892600
>BTC is a ponzi-like scheme

You're just retarded in a profound way

>>55892952
it doesn't. it has 18 milllions XMR and will have 33 millions at the end of century. How is that infinite?

>>55892773
>exactly. basically everyone who invested lost money
Nice irony, but ...
Everyone who invested in the last 6 years had comparable returns to those of index funds.
And they exposed themselves to the risk of bitcoin being regulated into -90%, which is a threat that index funds are not facing.
Meanwhile pretty much every shitcoiner who at least stayed consistent and didn't deliberately put money into scams got at least one x100.
>>55892783
How can you further corrupt something that has already been rendered useless?
>>55892805
Problem is, the current state was not supposed to be final. There was supposed to be a functional decentralised layer 2 with brainlet-friendly UI and low fees. Instead we got blocks full with jpegs.
>>55892810
True, and if bitcoin was a good coin rather than a useless bag holding system, that would have been a solid argument.
>>55892813
>calling others late adopters
early adopters moved into Bitcoin Cash and Ethereum you 2017 newfag
>>55892814
?
>>55892838
>I can send the equivalent of $1b USD across the world in 10mins for less than the cost of a mcdouble 24/7 without counterparty risk
Bullshit, glowies will be on high alert for any multi million dollar transaction, which brings you the same counterparty risk as with banks. You can't cash it out and you can't use it for anything else, since transaction fees are too high for anyone to accept it.
Your schizophrenia would have served you better if you had focused on shitcoins.
>seething
I am absolutely mad that you faggots destroyed bitcoin. But I did outperform you monetarily. I would have been poorer had you not spread bitcoin's potential utility into numerous altcoins that start from a lower cap.
You destroyed bitcoin out of greed and made no money off it. A self-destructive cuckold.
>>55892969
What's keeping bitcoin above $0 other than new brainlets buying, hoping to sell to even newer brainlets?

>>55893045
>Bullshit, glowies will be on high alert for any multi million dollar transaction, which brings you the same counterparty risk as with banks
This is so fucking bullish for XMR. $100B market cap is FUD

>>55893045
>glowies will be on high alert for any multi million dollar transaction, which brings you the same counterparty risk as with banks.
"Glowies" knowing about my legal business transactions is not a counterparty risk
>You can't cash it out and you can't use it for anything else, since transaction fees are too high for anyone to accept it.
Why would you buy statist shitcoins? And false, BTC is literally cheaper to transact with than paypal for values over $20

>>55893202
>This is so fucking bullish for XMR. $100B market cap is FUD
It's definitely proof that XMR is needed.
But utility is not what makes coins moon anymore.
XMR will also be outperformed by a stack of complete shitcoins.
Still, I'll never shit on a XMR holder like I would for a corekek.
>>55893238
Your legal business transactions will be subject to way less scrutiny if you do them through a bank.
Glowies see any big bitcoin transaction as suspicious, and cashing out on the other end is a pain in the butt.
You're guilty of money laundering until proven innocent and I've already suffered a ton because of that.
> BTC is literally cheaper to transact with
You'll pay at least 10% in different counterparty fees until you're able to cash it out, you'll waste weeks if not months of your life proving that the source is legit.
Just use a fucking bank, brainlet.
BTC is literally a bank with extra steps nowadays.

>>55893310
>But utility is not what makes coins moon anymore.
>XMR will also be outperformed by a stack of complete shitcoins.
>Still, I'll never shit on a XMR holder like I would for a corekek.
I just can't buy anything else, I'll die poor then, fuck clown world

>>55893310
>Just use a fucking bank, brainlet.
>BTC is literally a bank with extra steps nowadays
as a founder having raised money in crypto, I confirm.

>>55893045
tl;dr.
nobody cares. if you actually knew what you were talking about you'd be a mult millionaires.

listening to poor people talk about crypto like they get it (perfect example being the kike in op) is why they're still poor.

>>55891687
Price of bitcoins= price of shitcoins, if bitcoin tanks shitcoins do as well.

>But utility
Utility of a currency isn't important, value is.

>>55892838
BTC tx takes at least 1 day though
>less than the cost of a mcdouble
?

>>55891687
i lost too much to care

>>55893488
>if you actually knew what you were talking about you'd be a mult millionaires
Literally everyone who has been in crypto since the block size war, and is not a corekek or a creg pajeet already become one, you brainlet.
Imagine being so deep into corecuckoldry that you think this is somehow special or rare.
>>55893368
Based crypto founder.
I hope you find a way out, anon.

>>55893310
>b-but if you include multiple unnecessary BTC<->shitcoin transactions it's expensive!
Cry moar statist, your shitcoin is going to zero

>>55893542
>n-no it takes 10 years per transaction! if it doesn't have at least half a million confirmations it hasn't really been transfered!

>>55892991
>it has 18 milllions XMR and will have 33 millions at the end of century.

It seems like you found an evasive way to answer.
What is the hard upper limit for the number of XMR coins in circulation?

>>55893564
> Cry moar statist
Imagine being this new lmfao.
Small blocks is literally what gave up crypto to the statists.
If you weren't so new and poor you would have known.
> your shitcoin is going to zero
I have dozens of them, and I literally have more x100-es than ones that have goon to 0.
Cope harder dumbass.
Maybe if you're lucky you'll beat inflation this year.

>>55893548
so why aren't you then? pretending to know it all but having nothing to show for yourself is pretty embarrassing, especially while crying for 8 years that the attempted coup by miners, exchanges, and people like roger ver didn't work out. that was obvious from day one when you saw the low-t people on the wrong side of history.

>>55893808
1/2
>so why aren't you then
What makes you think that?
> pretending to know it all but having nothing to show for yourself
What makes you think that?
> while crying for 8 years
8 since bitcoin unlimited I guess
> attempted coup by miners, exchanges, and people like roger ver
How is it a coup when everyone with skin in the game supported it, lmao?
How is what happened not a real coup, when it had to be done through hacking, DDoSing nodes, taking over complete control of communication platforms, banning all OGs and paying bots to astroturf content, making sure every newfag becomes a corekek zealot.
The only mistake Ver and the gang made was thinking that having truth to their side is enough to overcome all of that.
The way you say it you make it seem like they wanted to take over BTC to make more money. What happened with Blockstream taking bitcoin over actually made both Ver and Jihan more money.
Ver is a seed investor in Binance and Kraken, and he made billions in the shitcoin craze.
Jihan literally held 10% of all AVAX in circulation when the market cap was $80,000,000,000.
None of those people cared about money during that fight, they cared about saving bitcoin.
They literally made more money thanks to brainlets like you supporting bitcoin's destruction, and you still believe some midwit-tier blockstream lie. Just like I did.
And yet we're all mad at you for destroying bitcoin.
How can't you see that your idols are the ones who destroyed a society-changing network, and the ones who stood against them were willing to sacrifice profits to do what's right?
> that was obvious from day one
That was spammed by bots on manipulated platforms such as bitcointalk and /r/bitcoin, and you just stood there and scooped all of it. Probably got vaxxed as well.
> low-t people on the wrong side of history
Low-T people do not stand up to bullies like Roger and Jihan did. Low-T people nod their head in agreement to bullies, which is what you're doing.

>>55893808
2/2
> wrong side of history
Bitcoin increased economic freedom from 2010 till 2015.
Ever since the scaling war started, and especially since small blockers won, all it has done was to create new bagholders.
And to create a cult.
Which cult forbade its followers from making more money in pretty much any other alt.
Which cult literally encouraged them to sell their houses to buy more.
This was not the bitcoin of pre-2016. Bitcoin has been a joke since Mike Hearn left.

>>55893548
thanks anon, I hope I do too. It's a crazy journey, tiresome and intense
>>55893604
irrelevant, what matters is what is the cap in your life time and the next 100 years after, perhaps. Do you think gold is valued for its supply in 1000 years? You know, deep in your heart, that a hard capped supply is a stunt

>>55893045
well if you think bitcoin is so shit then why hasn't bitcoin cash overtaken it by now? why no one uses bitcoin cash to buy groceries all over the world? (outside of a few bch bagholders in used panties vending machines in japan paid off by roger ver)? why no one uses bitcoin SV or any other shitcoin? there is thousands of them, sure there is at least one that has all the nice features and UI you would want right? so what is the issue? well the issue is that only a retard buys crypto just to spend it the next day buying groceries or paying for gas. People buy bitcoin run away with their savings from FIAT, yes bitcoin's price has risk and volatility but it's better than just sitting in FIAT like a cuck and taking 5-30%inflation each year like a loser

>>55894307
How many BTC transactions are made to buy real world goods each day?

>>55894344
probably very little, just like nobody buys a car a house or a pound of meat with a gold bar/coin

>>55894307
1/2
>why hasn't bitcoin cash overtaken it by now
It only had a chance in 2017 and it took market manipulation to prevent it.
Same with ETH, tbqh.
Exchanges stop trading, a billion USDT gets printed and we all get suddenly richer.
Once both of these failed to overtake BTC once, it was kind of assumed they're getting second place.
Bitcoin Cash has been a total disaster since the BSV fork tbqh, first there was the huge PR nightmare of having Craig on your team, then the speculative nightmare of having to split off with a multi billionaire on the other end. Once Amaury also quit, it was totally toast, I had sold my last one way before that.
Bitcoin Cash was supposed to overtake BTC through increased utility thanks to being the first to implement Avalanche consensus. Then the BSV fork wars started, everything turned to shit, and we ended up buying the avalanche consensus coin for $0.33 instead of $600. Worked for us, sucked for BCH.
> why no one uses bitcoin cash to buy groceries all over the world
It's kind of the main thing on a few islands. Apart from those, not even being a top 30 coin, it's hard to convince people to do it. That's why it was important to all of us that we retain the bitcoin name. You can't convince people to use the 30th coin out there, even if the former 29 are unusable and the 30th one is. Just feels weird.
Bitcoin already had major network effects and corekeks even managed to reverse those. Hard not to be bitter about it.
> vending machines in japan paid off by roger ver
You overestimate the guy, and BCH is about to become legal tender in more countries than BTC (both in the Carribean). It's not completely ogre for BCH, but I'm not holding any substantial amount because it feels like a poor investment.
> why no one uses bitcoin SV or any other shitcoin
Because SV is a scam.

>>55894307
2/2
> there is thousands of them, sure there is at least one that has all the nice features and UI you would want right? so what is the issue?
The issue is that bitcoin had all of that, we were literally doing better than Venmo/Revolut on the UI side, exactly thanks to Roger Ver, that's back in 2016. And corekeks absolutely demolished that advantage, and the fork that had the potential to continue that was smeared relentlessly, driving adoption away from it. And corekeks still support this bullshit to this day.
> the issue is that only a retard buys crypto just to spend it the next day buying groceries or paying for gas
Pretty much all of these retards managed to hold thousands of bitcoins though. Despite spending another thousand. And you adopted bitcoin late. Let go of the hubris, thinking that you know better than them, when reality is obviously showing you that you're not in the right.
Now that the "revolution" has been destroyed, yes, it makes little sense to use crypto as cash in the current day. But many of you newfags don't remember that when the enthusiasm was present, we were literally ahead of Venmo and Revolut in terms of UX, and we had a solid chance of actually becoming a widely used currency.
It only looks stupid from the lens of the current day.
> People buy bitcoin run away with their savings from FIAT
And it's a horrible place to run to. It can be regulated into -90% tomorrow. At least with the rest of the crypto market, you have a chance of a x100. With BTC, you have no real upside, you're gaining as much as your boomer tech-focused mutual fund. Your only cope is if regulation hits crypto, you'll lose 90% while some shitcoiners will lose 95%. As if that matters.
> yes bitcoin's price has risk and volatility
And no upsides. That's the thing.
> but it's better than just sitting in FIAT
Implying that's your only two options, lmao

>>55891687
I don't see how that is a bad thing? Bitcoin is a finished project, so what?

>>55891687
Crypto was never alive. The sole purpose of it was to purchase CP and drugs on Tor. Then some nerds decided it was better not to purchase black market goods and services, just purchase the encrypted coin then the value will skyrocket. Then that Silk Road faggot doxxed himself on Freedom Hosting and the party van hired a bunch of millennial russian hackermans to raid dark web CP and animal torture rings. BTC could no longer be used for nefarious purposes. Every transaction while encrypted could eventually be traced with enough elbow grease. BTC since then was all about selling the fake news that it's needed by early maxis like CZ, max keiser, brian armstrong, bitboy, gongo and that one latefag nutter saylor. Luckily i'm finally profitting of it 100% now, but in the grand scheme of things it's not much to brag about since i came in right around the time saylor did. This boomer scam can't continue for much longer in my opinion

Tl;dr - the BTC fatigue is real fr fr

>>55891687
What development happened to gold in the past 1000 years?

>>55894383
>>55894418
you keep blaming everything around just not to see and accept the reality that nobody cares about transacting in crypto, people don't need a new fancy way to pay for things, people want to get rich or at least make SOME profits over time.

>>55894659
/thread

>>55891687
Shut up newfag

>>55892411
Shut up tech illiterate retard, don't ever talk about things you have no clue about

>>55894739
And preserve wealth, which will be harder over time. Making profits without working will become a luxury so profit while it lasts.

>>55892527
>>55892600
Hooly shit the two stupidest posters on /biz

>>55894030
They changed the distribution already what's to say they won't again?

Shitcoiners are soooo stupid.

>>55894383
>Bitcoin Cash has been a total disaster since the BSV fork tbqh
Changing the rules frequently is always a disaster.

>>55892527
>BSV
>Bitcoin: Sanjay's Vision
>2023

Lyl
Lmao even

>>55894418
Even ETH admitted you need layers for this to work.

You're stuck in the past wasting you time.

>>55891687
>What
>What
>What
>What
>What
>What

>muh tech
>muh devs
>muh transaction times
>muh scalability
>muh communities
>muh fees
>muh privacy
these are shitcoins trigger words; know them, avoid them

>>55892838
based beyond belief

>>55892991
>33
Nice glowie freemason coin you have there.

>>55894739
yeah, same midwit misunderstanding that if people wanted to pay with bitcoin then there wouldn't have been any dispute. but people don't want to pay with crypto in general so why ruin decentralization to support something that won't be used for its intended purose

>>55892600
> Money can be used as cash. BTC is a ponzi-like scheme, with high risk and low reward.

funny. Since BCH forked off its gone down in price 10x while bitcoin is up in price 10x. BSV is 100x lower in price.

BCH is the ponzi-like scheme: it is guaranteed to fail unless the price increases exponentially to keep the dwindling awards worth enough to pay for security.

>>55891687
same reason ETH maxis can't accept/integrate the fact that their whole ponzi scheme house of cards depends on Tether, which has been found guilty of fraud in the US multiple times

the fact is there, staring us all in the face, but they can't see it because if they did, they would have to accept that everything they know to be true is actually a lie. in that sense it's similar to the vaccine, covid, the 2020 election, and ukraine. cognitive dissonance overwhelmingly powerful.

nobody would touch btc unless they thought it could make them money.

the ever diminishing returns, coupled with the massive unsustainable growth and greed of the last 10 years means it will become a less and less practical and desirable investment. this process already started.

>>55894433
Bitcoin hasn't even started yet. Chads know this and are bagging, alongside alt gems with AstraDAO being at the front row. Not rocket science.

>>55894739
>nobody cares about transacting in crypto
They cared before idiots like you joined crypto, that's the whole thing.
People don't care about doing it now because crypto has been ruined.
>>55895120
>tech illiterate retard
>no arguments
I've literally owned tech companies in 4 different jurisdictions within a decade of starting off as a code monkey.
Codemonkeys during the scaling war used their tech literacy as an excuse for being financially/econimically illiterate.
Also, oneliners aren't arguments, try harder next time.
> And preserve wealth
Wealth can only be preserved with assets of value. Bitcoin is a soft-ponzi for speculators, and the first asset to go down once central banks tighten monetary policy. Even my synthesizer collection retained its value more better during the past 3 years than bitcoin did.
>>55895216
Amazing arguments, newfag brainlet
>>55895242
Bitcoin changed its goals and directions, too, over the years. And it has forgone hard forks in the past, as much as small blockers like to pretend that it hasn't. You like to hang to meaningless straws like a fixed supply, when it literally means nothing in the grand scheme of things. You still don't know who is going to be mining bitcion past 2140 in your fantasy world.
>>55895288
>Changing the rules frequently is always a disaster.
The world is always changing and you can't rely on a set of rules to keep you afloat indefinitely, that's a fallacy spread by autistic men.
Changing rules frequently has done wonders for Ethereum and Avalanche.
Bitcoin Cash had a leadership problem, that BTC did not have, exactly because BTC is more centralised.

>>55895306
>Even ETH admitted you need layers for this to work.
You apparently believe propaganda, stating that bitcoin cash people were AGAINST layers.
This was never the case.
Bitcoin Cash proponents simply didn't want years of network building to be destroyed, in order to artificially push transactions onto second layers.
We wouldn't even have an argument if a functional second layer was in place.
There was never a functional second layer, and corekeks still absolutely demolished everything that was being accomplished in terms of adoption, and that's the whole issue.
I'd like to think that second layers can solve issues, but none of those has been invented yet, and it's already 6 years since bitcoin got destroyed.
>You're stuck in the past wasting you time.
I made it from AVAX which gives me plenty of time, and like spending some of it educating newfags on what really happened since the beginning of bitcoin, otherwise they'd get their news from propaganda, or from other newfags who read propaganda, and this is not healthy for the cryptocurrency sphere.
>>55895355
You seem pretty new and you don't understand what cryptocurrency was all about between 2010 and 2015.
To be fair, cryptocurrency nowadays is exactly about making money and nothing else, and yes, in that case, those things don't matter.
And won't until CBDCs get implemented. Then you'll whine and ask why nobody spend time thinking about them when we still had the opportunity.
> but people don't want to pay with crypto in general
You're just too new to this. In 2015 crypto had a comparable UX to Venmo and could have easily overtaken it.
If corekeks hadn't destroyed what others had built, people would have wanted to pay with crypto.

>>55895625
> Since BCH forked off its gone down in price 10x
Technically it forked at $300 and we doubled our stacks during the BSV fork, so incorrect.
But that's beside the point.
I'm not shilling BCH to anyone here, in fact, I don't own any substantial amount of it.
You're projecting because YOU are the one shilling BTC. And yes, it'a a horrible investment.
>>55897155
>nobody would touch btc unless they thought it could make them money
Bingo.
It's a bad store of value.
People don't buy it to store value, they buy it hoping they can make money.
While it has one of the worst risk-reward ratios out of all investments out there, partly because of its high market cap. At least shitcoins have x100 potential.
Bitcoin has at best a x2 short term potential, with 90% of the downsides that shitcoins face.
> Bitcoin hasn't even started yet
I mined my first one in 2011, and I'm pretty confident bitcoin ended in 2017.
Sorry, you're late, anon.

>jewish money lender spambots fudding the most undervalued asset in the history of mankind

absolute bottom signal