/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>54853754
>you must feel bad because normies think that you're a loser
but i am a loser

I don't think this is true anon, we are just in a market downturn. Your criticisms, in addittion to being hyperbolic bullshit, apply to any career.

>>54853754
>Just a few years ago, every normie and their mother hopped on the bandwagon, enthusiastically talking about or studying Computer Science (CS).
When that happens, it's probably when you know that the thing has peaked. This applies to crypto as well. If a coin is TOO well-known, it is an excellent time to sell.
> Software development was hailed as the ultimate pathway to success, as if becoming a code wizard would magically unlock a world of wealth and fame.
It's still a decent place to be job-wise, but it used to be better.
>They were revered as the architects of the future, shaping the world with their sacred lines of code and conjuring technological marvels out of thin air. With their mighty algorithms, they could make self-driving cars navigate the trickiest of traffic situations, create virtual reality realms where we could escape our boring realities, and even summon e-commerce platforms that made buying unnecessary things even easier. We marveled at their seemingly supernatural abilities, as if they were modern-day sorcerers wielding keyboards instead of wands.
> But now..
Artificial Intelligence and Machine Learning, Anon. You might want to look in that field. If you were already in the job field and made a lot of money, see about leveraging the AI-generated Photos for video game development.
> With a flooded job market and the rise of pajeet outsourcing, many software developers find themselves laid off, disrespected, and even mocked in broader society.
This is why you want Donald Trump back. Donald Trump put a $150k/year minimum salary for H1B Visa workers, which caused software engineer salaries to skyrocket. Joe Biden didn't repeal that executive order of Trump's until late 2022 around the midterm elections. That is when you see mass layoffs in tech.

>>54853754
We were fortunate to secure excellent jobs, earn a substantial income, and achieve success, ultimately leading to early retirement. It seems you might have missed that opportunity. The issue isn't with computer science itself, but rather the global realization that the future is uncertain.

From now until 2030, we can anticipate a series of crises, and from 2030 to 2050, it will become increasingly evident that we're approaching a turning point. Given this context, job markets and related concerns have always been mechanisms to maintain a sense of purpose and accomplishment for the population—a proverbial horse race.

>>54853890
DONALD TRUMP! TRUMP, TRUMP TRUMP.

Donald Trump put a minimum salary for H1B visa workers to $150k/year. Contrary to popular belief, employers cannot pay H1B visa workers less. In order to get those positions, they have to list the positions, lowball American citizens so low that they refuse, and then hire an H1B Pajeet to do the work.

>>54854000
I'm not American tbhdesu. FAANG is building new offices in Canada...

>>54854024
You guys don't have any clue. Donald Trump was not only good for America but good for the world:
> No war
> Peace in the Middle East
> Stable economies across the globe.

But most people are too stupid to vote for the benefit of humankind.

Men always want to root for their team.

Women agree for the sake of getting along.

Consequently, the average normie votes for corrupt politicians like Pelosi, who use insider trading to become insanely wealthy, while the rest of us get fucked over.

And Trudeau is a WEF black-face minstrel and homosexual faggot.

>>54854093
Go back to /pol/ with your cuck porn

>>54853754
It's both over-and underrated at the same time.
Breaking down complicated problems and finding easy solutions is a skill you can learn. Doesn't matter what field, it's what makes a man a good engineer.
At the end of the day, you should be focusing on providing value to the end-user and more freedom. The tools you achieve it with don't matter.

>>54854190
It stands true for software engineering, medicine, politics, arts, and all the other fields.
If you fail to respect the free will of another you are not a bad programmer/politician, you failed as a person.

>>54854114
It's not cuckolding if both people are in a committed relationship together. And it's not porn.

>>54854190
>>54853754
You could just become a farmer. Either invest in urban agriculture through vertical farming or move out to the countryside and get thirteen acres of land.

>>54853939
Based. Gotta love the Donster. Ya just gotta! American Greatness, baby!

>>54853754
Software Engineer here. Feels like the industry's going the way of manufacturing, except instead of going overseas the jobs are being abstracted into oblivion. Sysadmins and code monkeys are a thing of the past, except at legacy shops - plenty of them to cut your teeth in but the dated skillsets might set you back professionally and pay is pretty mediocre. It's all about working with development infrastructure/tooling and understanding engineering methodology. Knowing how operating/software systems work and how to code is a "given" for the role, but it doesn't guarantee a job. The expertise has become so commoditized it makes your head spin. Deep tech is the last frontier to make it as an engineer but you've got to be really fucking good, really fucking smart, or really fucking early.

>>54853754
i been working software dev during the boom just collected pay check now im just got my pilot license gonna get some of those airline gibs. just follow the money

Imagine thinking a job where you're paid by an employer with 0 profit to make software that makes you obsolete was ever going to be secure lol

>>54853754
It's simple. With 0 interest rates for 10+ years, VCs threw billions at companies with no business model. That's how you got Uber, Doordash, AirBnB, etc. etc. etc. these companies suddenly had more money they knew what to do with and starting competing for software engineers driving salaries to insane levels.
Now that money isn't free anymore, everything is crashing. Most of the software engineers who caught the wave already made it and are not coming back. The late comers who got in at the end of the hype cycle are screwed. It's worse than the dotcom bubble, the market for entry level positions is completely flooded.

I wish the NPCs would just leave this field so I can just enjoy my C-language embedded systems and kernel programming world at a decent wage

>>54853754
India is what went wrong.

>>54855322
Explain how to break into "deep tech" as a CS major (year 2).

>>54853754
my company is shifting everything to bogota and india. Glad i m old....if you learn cs now you re 30Y too late (in USA....if you re in india/LATAM/EU go for it....in this order)

>>54855522
Bringing Trump back would help fix the problem

>>54853754
A few years ago? It was decades ago. If you think it was a few years ago you're probably remembering some echo that was bouncing around your local school district.

>>54853754
99% of these faggots are cargo cult programmers...software performs worse every day despite hardware improvements. The techpocalypse can't come soon enough.

>>54855670
> software performs worse every day
this. Even with the Linux kernel, there's so much bloat and trash
> flatpaks
> snaps
> pulseaudio, pipewire, fucking wireplumber
kill it all. i'm beginning to see why even systemd had its opponents

>>54855656
>>54855592
High-interest rates, plus Joe Biden repealed Trumps executive order to place a minimum salary of $150k/year for H1B Visa workers

>>54853754
If you made it to early retirement by now, then computer science was the right choice. If not, then pray that things will work out for you.

>>54853754
>Just a few years ago, every normie and their mother hopped on the bandwagon,
That's what happened, dummy. Everyone and their dog went into computer science, now the field is saturated with talent.

Supply > demand = salaries decrease and people have more difficulty finding work

Basically no one's gone into accounting over the past ten years, and now I'm getting recruiters begging me to go on job interviews for WFH senior accounting positions basically playing around on Excel all day long for $90-100k.

Sucks to suck, coding monkeys lmfao

>>54855878

Why is someone using a VPN to post various AI generated images of young girls with old men?

>>54856052
How do you know that it's AI-Generated? It looks real to me

>>54855973
how has accounting not been automated yet?
i literally did my taxes online in 30 minutes

>>54856052
>>54856005
Plus, I generated probably hundreds of pics using these softwares.

>>54853754
you should've gone into journalism. Me likey your wordy

>>54856124
That's what I was told in school too, instead of do computer science. But, shit money, many already lost their jobs, AND automation take many writing jobs now.

>>54856102
the programs are made by computer scientists not accountants. lots of accounting rules are fairly ambiguous or open ended. its literally called "generally accepted accounting principles", there is no 1 definitive way to do it. the way an accountant or the way an auditor come up with the book value of an item will be completely different. there is no way to just force a bunch of conditional ifs statements to figure out the numbers.

>>54853939
AI is saturated, do not enter. Got fucked royally with that, even with phd.

chatgpt is blocked on my company's network ;)

>>54856102
Bookkeeping =/= accounting

Doing an individual tax return with a W-2 =/= accounting

Huge corporations have very difficult tax returns.
Public companies have to be audited each year.
From an industry perspective, there's so many odds and ends in a monthly close that there is no way an AI system could close the books on your average sized company by itself at least

ultimately your position is unskilled if a rando pajeet ranjesh patel can undercut you lol

>>54856205
You should probably become a real estate developer instead.

>>54855778
you re so dumb it hurt....we are sending work there. not bringing anybody. no need of visa....

>>54856256
what's this supposed to mean? pajeets can do everything a white man can do, the IQ difference between Brahmins and whites is marginal.
sure they smell like shit and are ugly but that doesn't mean they can't read a textbook and apply the knowledge

>>54856073
some people need to cope. some ppl never touch a women here

>>54856333
You're right, but there's also a limitation to that. Sometimes work HAS to be done within the US because of legal restrictions. For instance, handling financial information or HIPAA is a crime. Cybersecurity concerns is another one

>>54856368
cool you saved 2%of DEV in US. In another thread tonight a guy show a DEV offer in Boston. 3 days 150k applications.... >>54853117

>>54855528
Deep tech refers to bleeding edge technologies, especially those which have a heavy research/theoretical element.

I fall under the "really early" category. The "really good" engineers and "really smart" researchers tend to get discovered from the caliber and volume of their work output, but I took a rather windy path and stumbled into it. Hit it off with an extremely early-stage founder with aligned interests and complementary knowledge/skills I met at a conference, the company established immaculate PMF a few months later, and things quickly took off afterward. I'm pretty broad generalist with some niche expertise and cross-domain knowledge, but I'm not sure I would be qualified to join the company at this stage had I not heavily contributed to it being where it is from the beginning. Once well-managed tech companies are established and have good funding, they tend to hire exponentially more qualified candidates to maintain their growth trajectory and competitive edge.

What I believe helped me get here over the past decade and a half:

>Hobby projects
Build things, tinker, explore concepts in your free time. It's good to have at least an open-ended project or two that keep you exploring different approaches. Follow discussions and read research related to it. It really helps for your hobby interests to be tangentially related to deep tech, but not a requirement - the experience compounds over time either way. Feel free to pick up new projects over time, but the point is continuous learning and problem-solving related to things you're passionate about.

(cont)

>>54855511
Go to finance my boy. In particular find a small prop/hft shop. I got into obe out of school when all this tech bubble burt shit was 2 months in with 0 effort simply due to most CS students oriented themselves towards the big tech webdev stack. And findingg people good at what you just described is rarer and rarer by the day

>>54855670
This.

>>54856407
Noted

>>54855528
>>54856456
>College CS research
It's at the intersection of the theoretical and applied CS, and introduces you to new ways of thinking about and approaching problems. Most universities tend to cluster around research of a particular niche. Look into what research your university department contributes most heavily to. If you're interested in the area, get involved; if you're not, transfer somewhere that better suits you. Go for a master's if you want, but don't pursue a PhD unless you have superhuman passion/drive and want to be a researcher for the rest of your life. If you can find research that aligns with your hobby interests, especially powerful.

>Work for a startup
There are plenty of startups looking for entry level talent. They're probably not going to pay you a lot, but it's probably the easiest way to get your foot in the door in the industry without a college MANGA internship. Definitely go for the MANGA internship if you can, in which case my advice might be completely irrelevant by comparison. Good intro to how things actually work on the job.

>Work for a legacy tech company, but don't get stuck
If you interned MANGA, probably skip this. There's a sea of companies inefficiently running on legacy software and infrastructure, many which I presume give you decent autonomy in the role. Good fulltime entry level opportunities if you have qualifying skills and a little bit of prior work experience. Learn how the infrastructure works, automate its testing, improve/modernize it, build it out as required, learn how to interface with other departments to meet their needs (intrapreneurship). Automate/modularize/genericize your work and that of others a much as possible, and try to establish yourself as an internal systems authority for job security. Use the spare time and energy to invest in other endeavors while collecting a stable paycheck. Also sheds light at times concerning how not to run a company or department.

(cont)

>>54856343
Yeah. I probably should use that for an AI-prompt porn

>>54855528
>>54856456
>>54856507
>Learn software engineering
Coding, algorithms, and data structures are a very small part of software engineering. Methodology is a science in itself that's worth familiarizing yourself with. Also try to learn what technologies/platforms are being used in the field and how to leverage them to make work, testing, deployments more elegant. Spend some spare time reading about the state of the art, whether articles, forums, or Wikipedia rabbit holes related to the field. The Google engineering resources were golden with respect to this early in my career, and I encourage you to apply/interview with MANGA companies or at least explore their resources even if you don't end up working there.

>Independent business study
If you're not looking to work in a business-oriented role at a large corporation, you don't need an MBA, but you should still independently study business, finance, and economics to understand the business side of things - operations, health, strategy, and industry outlook - and/or to hold a conversation with those who are better geared to business leadership. The proverbial electrons in the covalent bond between the INTP engineering autist and the ENTJ business chad.

>Start and operate a side-business
It'll cost you some money (filing fees, overhead) but it's good to have some hands on experience with the complexities of owning and operating a company and wearing a lot of different hats and interacting with people of various levels of "technicality" which is all valuable even if the company fails, which it likely will. You really come to appreciate how to and how not to do business, and understand the local business landscape: skills, needs, competition. Also helps you better relate to, understand, and vet more natural business types you'll meet down the road.

(cont)

>>54856507
>There's a sea of companies inefficiently running on legacy software and infrastructure,
this is sort of the crosssroads lots of older tech companies are stuck at. they basically had 1 or 2 tech boomers that are now nearing retirement/already retired who were the only people that knew how to run/use that system, and ai isnt quite advanced enough to do their job entirely. i wouldnt say "easily" but you definitely can find decent tech jobs if you are willing to learn how a very specific piece of infrastructure works.

>>54855528
>>54856456
>>54856507
>>54856563
>Get involved in open source
Publish your hobby work, especially if you can "productize" it for others to play with or use. Contribute to open source projects related to your interests. Also seems to be an effective way to scout out talent among some recruiters. You can also make contacts in your target field of choice. Especially powerful if you're looking to break into deep tech in a particular area and contributing to related projects, since even deep tech companies use a lot of open source software. Finally, it's a way to build a brand/portfolio of relevant work.

>Go to conferences
If you want to meet people working on the state of the art, this is the way to do it. Travel and run up a little credit card debt in the process if you must, and network like it's going out of style. Know who you'll likely be meeting, what they do, and introduce people if you can, but talk to anyone and everyone - a rich variety of different minds from different walks of life. Meetups are another way, but they tend to attract more hobbyists.

Hope this helps.

>>54856507
Honestly this last point is too good. For example alot of folks still run their servers on centos7 because they got psyoped by the RHEL cabal into thinking support would last longer than it did. So ample opportunity if youre a linux bro to tinker with their build system/deployment processes and do the grunt work of fixing their shit and changing it to work on a modern OS. My shit is in finance so i have no idea what happens in non c++ on baremetal servers in data centers types of work. But i been wanting to play around woth bpf and xdp for packet processing and as well as certain rdma style techniques on our smart nics. But we cant do it because we use centos7 and kernel 3.10.

Also i wanted to make a memory allocator for a certain workload we have and its hard as shit in c++11 but easy af in 17, but the issue is a database dependency that permeates everything, in particular the type of exception handling it does isnt allowed in c++17.

So the smart nic rdma shit, bpf/xdp, custom memory allocators and whatnot, caused us to have a meeting with Rocky and were little by little gonna transition to rocky9 and kernel 5.3+, so i have everything i need to blow shit out the water. But it takes all the hops and skips of grunt work orchestrating it all. Current biggest holdup is a proprietary device driver from a vendor we deal with.

So point is, entirely agree with being about deep tech and trying to get into a small compamy and use it as your training ground for you to little by little introduce your interests and implement them at "large" scale.

>>54856480
thanks anon, I will do what I can to weather the storm.

>>54856596
Thank you for all of this.

The CS community didn't do itself favors when you had cali faggots on tiktok bragging about the numerous company perks, the 300k salaries, signing bonuses, stock options at their FAANG company and yet still declining offers and acting like Real Madrid midfielders negotiating their contract with HR telling people to "know their worth".

All of that just to have 99% of coders being lazy suboptimal monkeys who's job can be done by pajeets with PhDs for 1/10 of the salary and without stock options.

Companies got tired of that bullshit and decided to focus 100% on outsourcing the work and reducing their need for local talent unless its for top projects like AI based projects.

>>54856633
Np fren. Are you still in school or you been working a while?

>>54856368
>AI based projects.
AI is pretty amazing

>>54856714
>>54856368
>>54855778

>>54856721
That one is the real one, which I used to AI-Generate the other three.

>>54856580
The sheer amount of code debt intertwined with mission critical business logic makes migration incredibly difficult. Terrible for company nimbleness, but a great career opportunity for junior engineers. But yeah, those openings do largely seem to be replacements rather than expansions.

>>54856630
I'm a Debian native myself, but I admittedly fell for the CentOS meme which they coincidentally used for infrastructure at the legacy shop. Brought it to the deep tech company early on due to having less configuration complexities with certain packages we were working with, but the rest of the team came to converge on a preference for Ubuntu.

Industrial-caliber HFT really sounds like a different world. Had no idea it was viable without preferential access to data, exchanges, or information. I flirted with HFT as a college hobby project, using homecooked DNNs to crunch normalized data scraped from Yahoo finance APIs. The simulation performed decently, but I began to study business initially motivated by an attempt to get a better edge. Once I started working as an engineer it fell by the wayside.

>>54856652
No problem. Good luck!

>>54856661
>All of that just to have 99% of coders being lazy suboptimal monkeys
True. Many lazy programmers >>54856661
>pajeets with PhDs for 1/10 of the salary and without stock options.
Most Pajeets are pretty strupid, anon. Not all, though. But, many are.

>>54856661
>AI based projects
It might be coming too fast for everyone

>>54855973
>senior accounting positions
>$90-100k
kek

>>54853754
Going into CS was a really good choice.... about 20 years ago. The people who were already experienced coders by the time the field peaked around 2020 must've made insane money. I personally have 3 friends who went into CS/SWE a bit too late, one of them turned out ok, 2 of them are still perma unemployed basically and looking at other fields/losing hope...

>>54853754
all computer labor was either offshored to pajeets willing to work for $6/hr or AI

>>54853754
Its still in high demand, but demand for actual qualified people, not a mother that took a bootcamp

>>54856849
>Industrial-caliber HFT really sounds like a different world. Had no idea it was viable without preferential access to data, exchanges, or information.

(1/2)
Truely. Before i started working I thought it was some wizard magic. But from my observations most folks seem to get by with just colocation to the data feeds, having some good NICs and packet parsers. Obviously the crazy crazy stuff the top people are doing is another level. But i do think within reason motivated people would be able to shell out the 2k a month for some rack space and a few 1p gig feeds if they have a fpga, a nic, and a reasonable server. I have a u50, u200, kcu 1500, and then 2 mellanox nics i tinker with in my freetime.

Its hard to keep motivation to play with them when i get home from work, but i just try my best to keep the dream. I majored in math and CS for my bachelor's and in my masters did alot of math theory in some SDN type research.

It was great fun. One course i did take was explcitly an algo trading/hft course by the math department. The prof was a functional analysis/PDE type of guy. Tldr he would teach fancy statistics theory, and then 2 week programming assignments on implementation of the theoretical algorithms/principles on real data.

.

>>54854241
I thought AI's would be used for better things like real art or security like 0x0, not for porn

>>54857064
(2/2)
I realized after i started working that the "pure finance" types think alot of reasonable trading algorithms are "dead" but they have no experimental backing, just them postulating. Whereas i have the opposite empirically. So i do hope in the next 2 years or so i can start up my own thing and maybe even go back to school if its moderately succesful enough to make TA/RA money worth it. Biggest thing im trying to do is get a packet parser going on the fpgas for the finance protocols. Not FIX but some other ones that there arent many open solutions for.

I guess question comes down to, if i do pull it off. It would put many vendors who exploit the lack of fpga knowledge among the boomer C programmer ground out to hang. So do i keep it private and Just try to do my own thing, show my company that ive created something that will save us thousands per year and we can get more performance by offloading algos to it, or make it open and try to use it as a base to get into intel/nvidia/amd ?

Curious for your thoughts. Nice chatting either way

>>54857074
*boomer C programmer crowd, out to hang.

>>54856946

>>54853754
Degrees are a meme, you picked a class that everyone else picked the the mods nerfed in into oblivion, I literally never went to school or was even home-schooled and before I was 25 I was on 130k usd doing IT work as a system admin and all I had to do was play on the milf HR recruiters heart strings. Now I do cyber security work on big government jobs and nobody gives a fuck about degrees or shit it's about certifications which are piss fucking easy and you can do over the weekend. Currently on 300k and all I had to do was study for the cissp after doing that system admin work for 7 years and that was it.

Phd (stem and some others) > Literally nothing > trade > home school > primary school > HS > masters > degree

>>54857074
With respect to personal projects, I open sourced one parallelism library I initially developed in academic research and further dogfooded it at a later employer, open sourced another couple repositories and launched them as a webapp for public consumption which opened some doors of opportunity in the form of consulting for a couple companies (was reluctant to leave my day job at the time) and building my network, while most of my other projects never really saw the light of day beyond personal use. None were extremely viable, though I mentioned one leveraging Google data while interviewing at the company, similar functionality which happened to show up in one of their services a little while later but I didn't land the job for.

Given the tremendous viability of what you're working on, I'd lean towards the former two, and mention it in your resume / CV and interview without disclosing too much if you opt to apply to Intel/Nvidia/AMD. If you're good on outbound and marketing products/services or know someone that can execute that side of things well and potentially engage with investors, and you don't have any restrictive contracts with your employer, I'd encourage attempting to capitalize on it. Otherwise, maybe roll it into your employer if you can secure favorable terms for it, like a promotion or something. At the very least, the cost reduction would be another point for your CV / resume.

Likewise, it's nice chatting.

>>54857072
Used it for financial forecasting, OCR, and some limited hybrid neural/genetic algo research and symbolic pattern recognition a decade ago, but wrote it off for NLP applications on personal computers in the pre-LLM era. Also didn't anticipate technologies like SD arriving on consumer hardware as soon as they did. I was blown away when I noticed anons beginning to use it for anime frame interpolation in the mid-late 2010s.