/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>53303385
Na

>>53303385
Why do you just spam fucking buzzwords? Is this a subtle shill? How does the current state of AI tech help crypto in any fashion?

>>53303440
You don't know and so you will never make it.

>>53303494
Thank you for the deflecting response instead of explaining how AI tech helps crypto.

>>53303506
It's the other way around
Crypto will help AI

>>53303551
Lol. Want to know how I know that you have financial interests in AGIX RLC and/or FET, through either being a bagholder or being paid to shill them?

>>53303582
You sound poor

>>53303619
Shocking, I was about to say the same about a person whose time is so worthless it's a good money per hour endeavor to shill on this god awful scam filled board.

>>53303642
Ask me how I know you're poor

>>53303506
>AI tech helps crypto
they are basically inseparable lmfao

>>53303689
My total portfolio in crypto and stocks is about 2.1 million. I'm a programmer who graduated with a bachelors 7 years ago and earns about 180k/year with an extra 15% of that added to a SEP IRA. I work from home and do maybe 20 hours of work a week. I live in an apartment that probably costs more per month than some of your friends and family make in a year.

/biz/ was never free of shills, but back in 2019 I feel like there were way less of this constant shilling and more actual crypto discussion. Third world faggots like you ruin things.

>>53303736
Ask me how I know you're a newfag

>>53303506
DYOR

>>53303751
Embarassing shill, honestly. Better luck in the next life to not be born into a third world shithole.

>>53303854
I've never seen somebody so mad at free information. You had like 5 years to buy AI coins

>>53303736
If this is all true why are you getting mad and defensive on a /biz/ thread
Were I in your shoes it would be hard for me to get mad at anything let alone something so trivial

>>53303930
I think he's larping and mad that he didnt get in AI coins early but doesnt realize its still early

>>53303551
Exactly this. I’m very surprised people haven’t realized the need for decentralized data to be used to train AI projects. So long as data being fed to AI is faulty, the AI is faulty. Therefore the data MUST be decentralized and transparent. Hello? Why is no one understanding this?

>>53303551
People might say “well look at chatgpt, it’s doing fine with the Reddit data and whatever other data openAI fed it”. And you’d be right to an extent, but it’s primarily a language transformer. What happens when companies start to develop predictive AI, like if a company will fail or a clinical drug will save lives? Wake up, biz. There’s only like a handful of projects that will benefit AI immensely when it is married to block chain

>>53303582
This is probably the stupidest fucking thing I’ve read on biz, nicely done. If an anon posts about an interesting project they think has value, what do you think the chances are that they themselves have bought it? Or should we all post about projects but aren’t allowed to invest in them?
>this Google company is revolutionary! I’m not invested though
Lol

>>53303736
Damn I miss pre-20 biz. Threads in general were way more informational. At least shill threads gave you some reasons to buy, even if it was a few paragraphs of fluff, at least there was some effort. Now we get:

>coin ticker
>buzzword (in this case “AI”)
>a sentence about how it will moon

rlc

>>53305884
It’s way worse but there still are some smart autists around. They usually come back during a bull run

>>53303385
https://vocaroo.com/1nbuYBxVYVsZ

>>53303385
RLC is not related to AI in any way, it's just quick cash for Gilles to afford his tranny travels and the anal surgeries when he comes back.
They dump and then they add just random buzzwords like 5g AI and other trendy shit to repeat the scam

>>53305884
Why would I waste my time typing to people that have their own motives and most likely already know this? I'd rather just say what will happen and give some coins that might benefit then laugh at idiots when it comes true

>>53305935
This isn't true, a simple google search proves you wrong lol. See, these are the types of people that come into these types of threads. Laggards and poor faggots

>>53305935
Have you seriously never taken part in iexec email demo and never contemplated the implications of their tech?

>>53305958
>>53305993
O MY, THE FUCKING RLC PAID SHILLS ARE BACK

>>53303385
Any of you fags into TAO? No exchanges yet, only OTC sales

>>53306013
No man, you’re just some salty fucking loser derailing threads with probably nothing to offer. Why not give some big brained takes on why RLC sucks? No? Just your knee-jerk “pajeet shills!”? I’m impressed. Been waiting for some high quality RLC fud but funnily enough it never comes.

>>53306041
>the klirus gang is back
PLS SIR YOU SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIR

>>53306013
Imagine not having at least 1 of the 3 AI coins I posted by now holy retard

>>53303736
>180k/year with an extra 15% of that added to a SEP IRA. I work from home and do maybe 20 hours of work a week. I live in an apartment that probably costs more per month than some of your friends and family make in a year.

>>53303385
>The AI pump
I remember when Facebook triggered a VR pump.

>>53306236
>Comparing AI to NFT Metaverse

>>53306013
How do I sign up for this? I just do it for my bags

>>53306064
>the 3
Holy shit you are stuck in your algorithm arnt you sir? For real try to get out of it.

>>53306307
I listed 3 coins in the OP stupid fag

What about Tao or rndr? Anyone know how rndr compares to RLC?

>>53306588
Whats up fellow tao-chad

>>53306588
I haven't looked into tao but i think rndr is mostly just rendering type jobs while rlc does a lot of weird stuff like data renting and confidential computing

>>53306538
That's exactly what i mean

>>53306588
>>53306626
Basically, with RNDR you share your GPU for rendering. With BitTensor (TAO) you share your GPU for AI learning.
The entire supply is mined, nothing minted. And so far you can only buy it OTC. Not yet on exchanges.

>>53306693
Most people will pump the trusted top coins before the gambler smallcaps

>>53306603
I watched a Matt Hamilton talk that was pretty interesting but I don’t even know how to buy it or check the price / market cap

>>53306821
>I don’t even know how to buy it or check the price / market cap

bittensor dot exchange > for price

>>53305943
I dont know you so I cant answer why you would or wouldnt do something. But I guess I would say the benefit of a more thorough post is it would get casual crypto guys like me to buy. I dont have time to do deep research but if someone makes a strong case for an alt, Ill throw some play money in it. You probably dont need the mes of the world to make your coin moon but it would be cool to spread the info and that way everyone makes money.

the "AI" crypto push feels too buzzwordy and midwit reddit tier to be true, and that's why it will probably pump

>>53303736
>My total portfolio in crypto and stocks is about 2.1 million. I'm a programmer who graduated with a bachelors 7 years ago and earns about 180k/year with an extra 15% of that added to a SEP IRA. I work from home and do maybe 20 hours of work a week. I live in an apartment that probably costs more per month than some of your friends and family make in a year.

Wow cool story nice larp 8/10. You're part of the problem. No one cares.

>>53303551
crypto helps protect against some of the disruptive effects of AI ubiquity

PHB chink AI coin with privacy, look it up niggers pump my bags its got a low mcap too

>>53305727
What is the AI learning that's helpful to crypto?

Wow, this thread is still up? You really need to learn how to change writing styles when ip switching. It's obvious half the posters in this thread are 1 person.

>>53305884
Yeah it's pretty bad. Nobody in this thread has even explained an ounce of what this AI does or what it's function is in fucking crypto, they just repeated the buzzword phrase "AI will change crypto! AI coins for the win!" over and over again.
I swear scams and shills used to be way higher effort. I got scammed once or twice back in the day, but I haven't been scammed in like 2 years now. They make it SO obvious.

>>53307105
That’s the entire point of the post. It’s the other way around. Good AI will rely on trustless data

>>53307270
You’re being purposely ignorant for some reason. It’s been mentioned ITT many times. Newly developed AI needs data that everyone can access and is not owned by a single institution. That’s almost the single most important use case of crypto

>>53307344
Okay, I'm actually a programmer so I can have a coherent conversation about this. How exactly does crypto gather open source data not owned by a single institution? I would love to see how the ethereum net or any other net assists in any fashion.

>>53307270
>>53307344
That’s not to say I agree with all the projects in OP. But crypto absolutely has a place in AI for trustless data

>>53307381
I mean, I’m not saying it’s fully developed. But one can imagine healthcare information for example could be stored on a distributed “ledger” much like eth blocks store transactional data to create an AI algorithm which predicts death. It seems you hate rlc but they also have a proven use case where that healthcare info could be kept completely confidential while the data remains usable for training the AI model.

>>53307501
Now why would they not just upload that data to a website? What purpose does crypto have?

>>53307527
I can’t tell if you’re trolling? In order for you to use whatever conceivable distributed project (which would aid the AI trustlessly) you need the native token to use its service. The higher the demand for said crypto service, price go up?

>>53307565
No, I'm saying why would these hospitals decide to use crypto to share this medical data instead of just creating a website called medicaldataproject.com and putting it on there?

>>53307576
Here’s just a couple reasons: 1) medicaldataproject.com is centralized and prone to data breaches while health care data is incredibly confidential. Distributed nodes (while confidentiality is protected) are immune to breeches or stoppages. 2) the hospitals dont need to use the data. Conceivably, hospitals (say in a certain state) collect data in some sort of state standardized way. Enter AI guy who wants to target those close to death that drug A will save from certain death, and offers hospitals his algorithm to identify then. Hospitals tell him to kick rocks, because he doesn’t have ethics and patients data must remain confidential. AI guy discovers RLC can keep patient data completely confidential while offering AI to that division of hospitals. Hospitals accept as their patient confidentiality is completely safe and now their patients are saved with drug A.
>t. ML medfag

>>53307716
You don't quite get how crypto works. You think just because it's crypto it's secure or something. (Fun fact: it's actually probably worse, as you might have seen by all the fucking hacks that go on in the crypto space)
1) Prone to breaches. Breaching what? Regardless of a crypto mainnet or web server connected to a website frontend, the hospitals have to scrub the data to make it anonymous before posting it online to this public, open source project. For instance:
>John Doe, male, recieved X treatment for Y disease at age 46 and this was the outcome.
Needs to be scrubbed to
>Anonymous person, male, recieved X treatment for Y disease at age 46 and here was the outcome.
This has to be done no matter how you want to distribute the files.
And by the way, there is next to no way to obsfucate/hide data in the ethereum mainnet. It is all public, that is the point. If you were to use a website you could potentially store the non-anonymous data in the backend and then only reveal the anonymous/scrubbed version to the user, although this would be a bad way to go about it.
2) I have no idea what you are trying to fucking say.

>>53307828
Have a lot to reply here but don’t think I’m down to converse that much with you anymore. Its clearly in bad faith
>I have no idea what you’re trying to fucking say
Don’t know what to tell you man. You complain about ppl not telling you a use case and just giving buzzwords and then get combative when someone tries. I’ll try it this way: AI guy has a model, needs pt data. Hosp doesn’t want to give data due to ethics. RLC enables hospital to completely protect pt data while predicting something of the patients with the model, AND model algorithm is also protected.

>>53307965
Lol. What you've described to me literally just a file distribution service that's anonymous. AI has nothing to do with it. And do you think there aren't many anonymous ways to submit data without the blockchain already? Your logic sounds as stupid as:
>okay hear me out for this crypto use case: an anonymous forum
>so you know how like reddit forces everyone to have a username and register with an account? what if we used crypto to host a forum where people could be anonymous and didnt have to submit their emails
>me: actually there are much easier ways to do that by just hosting a fucking website, in fact plenty of anonymous forums already exist
>YOU'RE CLEARLY ARGUING IN BAD FAITH anyways bye

>>53307344
I think the most important thing will be monetizing said data with RLC, but I could be completely wrong

I love this speculative investment, but i HATE ETH FAGGOT FEES. Cant even afford to hold these on my hardware becase it costs 7 dollars gas to send $9 to a wallet on eth. CUcked on centralized exchanges or cucked my gwei. I pray rlc agix and other port to hedera, matic, avax, or etc somewhere where I can afford to actually move money and dca in on a regular basis. those fees are nuts

I love this speculative investment, but i HATE ETH FAGGOT FEES. cant even afford to hold these on hardware becase it costs 7 dollars gas to send $9 to a wallet on eth. CUcked on centralized exchanges or cucked my gwei. I pray rlc agix and other port to hedera, matic, avax, or etc somewhere where its affordable to actually move money and dca in on a regular basis. those fees are nuts

>>53308000
Checked and except not really at all, programmer guy. In your retarded example of scrubbing the name but keeping clinical data, the AI modelers would still have and see that public clinical data and in theory be linkable back to an individual. This is not the case with RLC. The AI algo would act on completely protected confidential data

>>53308187
I see. So you want certain users to be able to link back public instances to the person. i.e. I could download the full public dataset but only see anonymous user #453, but an authorized user could see that anonymous user #453 is actually John Doe?
Quite easy without crypto. And basically impossible with crypto. Everything on the blockchain is public. If John Doe's real name is on the blockchain, everyone can see it. You would have to do some real encryption fuckery and do some tricks to only distribute that decryption key to the right people.

>>53308042
You are correct. Institutions could in theory rent out datasets confidentially.

>>53303385
I agree, all of the big crypto proyects that are up and coming have big tech and utility. Just look at XOR, everything that is coming from sora, from the fearless wallet to the sora card has all the utility non crypto users have asked for. This will moon hard, even for AI the future is bright

>>53308247
User #453, as an observation in any algorithm worth its salt, will have too many parameters NOT to be linked back to him. In other words we may have his weight, blood glucose, diseases, etc etc and with more variables it’s more obviously John Doe. NO ONE (in theory) needs to see these data for the algorithm to work on it. Hospital encrypts John does data, encrypted data sent to research firm to use its AI algorithm on it, with RLC the research firm doesnt even see input data, only what the AI spits out. That is absolutely not easy without crypto, as this transaction (receipts of input and output data, when to trigger decryption of results to appropriate party in this case the research firm) is recorded via blockchain

>>53308375
To be ultra specific you could in theory do this “without crypto” if you had some sort of decentralized consensus layer and iexecs tech, but Iexec made the rlc crypto token to use its service so yes crypto is needed

>>53308375
Oh so you're saying you want this private data to only be used to train the AI? You want nobody to look at it? You want to make sure John Doe's data is read by no human being, only an AI?
This is literally impossible. You must be misunderstanding what RLC is doing.
Short explanation: the programmers are who direct the flow of medical data. They can direct it into the AI, or they can direct it into an excel spreadsheet so they can read it. There is no possible way to ensure that the programmers do indeed route it into an AI. Also, why couldn't I just train an AI to repeat back to me someone's personal data?
Analogy explanation: Think of a pipeline containing a fluid. Imagine the medical data is a fluid, and I am sending you this fluid through a pipeline. You only want this fluid to be used by a machine, you do not want people to drink it. But how can you control what they do on their factory grounds? They can totally just connect the pipe into a water dispenser instead of connecting it to the machine. The only way to stop them from doing that would be to have some governmental inspectors look around the place and make sure they aren't doing that - and tell me, does RLC do that? Does RLC forcefully inspect the computers that it sends data to? Hell, even if it did force you to install a rootkit inspection tool on your computer I think the people who evade VAC anticheat would be thinking "this is my time to shine and make some cash".

>>53308436
>that’s literally impossible
Therein lies our disconnect, it is entirely possible with RLC. I agree of course the hospital stakeholders would likely “see” the data (clean it, ensure accuracy etc) but it’s not out of the realm of possibility that an electronic medical record collects automated data, after a few runs it self encrypts and is shipped off to a research firm. That research firm absolutely doesn’t see the data tho. I mean, if they chose not to run the data into their AI algorithm 1) the hospital now sees they’re not using the data as intended via blockchain ledger, thus never working with them again and 2) the research firm now has encrypted data with no way to decrypt and it’s utterly useless so congrats to them?

>>53308546
No, it is impossible to ensure that the data being sent is used in a specific way (in this case, used to train an AI). And even if it was possible, I would simply train an AI that could reply to "Tell me all the data about all known patients you have learned from in your training data".
Your misunderstanding of how programming works and why what you claim is impossible would take far longer to explain, but this is a simple counterargument that has no refutation.

Some servers have to act as the dataset provider and at this point it will already become centralized because you don't want randoms to have access to it nor do they have the storage capacity to be able to store petabytes of data.
This is similar to the hardcoded bootstrap node issue in blockchains.
You could argue the retarded validators could store the hashes, but the stored data still isn't decentralized and having someone to verify the data isn't a highly demanded feature, if even.
Your input can also be recorded by those who train your models and they for sure will do this. Also what happens if they return made up outputs in the training process? Low fp16 precision can always lead to small differences between training outputs and random values are commonly used.
The training process of a neural network involves random initialization of weights, and the use of stochastic gradient descent, which introduces randomness in the training process. Additionally, even when using the same initialization and training algorithm, the final trained model can vary due to the non-convex nature of neural network optimization.
It's smarter to rely on big cloud services, because if they steal your data, you can at least fuck them over and the likeliness for this to happen is extremely low.
Crypto currencies are not needed for such a system either since services can introduce their own credit system.

>>53308436
>>53308584
You're wrong, data confidentiality means data confidentiality. Have you seen the secret emails demo?

>>53308584
Ok man. No changing your mind. It’s a retarded argument tho. Even if it were impossible to tell if they were using it for their AI model, if they weren’t using it for the model it’s just a useless encrypted data file and they’re wasting money getting it

>>53308630
Wtf am I even reading is this chatGPT lmao

>>53308630
You lost me a little when you started talking about gradient descent cause you just started talking about random shit (also pretty sure the cutting edge AI's don't really use it because it's just random chance of whether you get stuck in a "pit", and with the insanely massive data sets you will need to explore an insane amount of "pits" to find the deepest value) but you obviously aren't clueless like these shills.

>>53308647
I have no idea what the fuck this shitcoin is but I assume a "secret emails" demo means that it ensures only the recipient and the sender know the contents of the email and not the rest of the blockchain. Wow, truly groundbreaking stuff. That's never been done before.

>>53308660
If it's a useless encrypted data file then what use is it to an AI? Obviously it's decryptable, and if it is decryptable, then the programmers will be able to decrypt it and see that private data.

>>53308691
just a single use case, there are a lot https://medium.com/iex-ec/dapp-of-the-week-08-heartify-a-blockchain-and-tee-healthcare-use-case-c500feb543a3

>>53308722
Oh, I see. This explains it far better than the other retard. It's literally just a shared sandboxed code environment where the owner of the data gets to check over the code being run using their encrypted data before it's actually run.
Again, this already exists outside of the blockchain and has existed for probably 20 years at least. Not very popular because most code is proprietary, and this gives all the code you want to execute to the person selling the data.

>>53308759
You’re about half as smart as you think you are, programmer guy. Lol. Never believed the mid wit meme til I interacted with you

>>53308782
>>53308187
Did you accidentally switch IPs? Rookie mistake.

>>53303385
why would ai pump crypto? i can't think of a reason
infact, it's a lot easier to imagine all the ways ai is bad for crypto
such as ai handling smart contracts autonomously

>>53308691
It was a reference to decentralized training.
One can't ensure the outputs are "sound" and resuming training at a certain epoch makes this procedure of validation an even worse nightmare.

AI tokens will go up in price. Not because of demand, but because of hype and clown world.
Adoption still not going to happen and the -98% after their bullrun is programmed just like the flaws in their concepts.

>>53308788
No, I got off my wifi. I didn’t hide I was the same anon, so your “gotcha” was about as retarded as you are. Lol.

>>53308822
Fair point with the decentralization. And another point: in general any blockchain will only serve as supplements for any AI work - the amounts of data it has to process are insane, and considering that uploading a normal sized png onto the blockchain literally costs thousands to millions, can't say I imagine AI will ever do much with the blockchain.
But what do you mean by AI token? That is an incredibly generic term and makes me think you're just another paid shill since everyone else has been throwing it around.

>>53308759
just another use case, there are many including robotics which i thought was cool
https://medium.com/iex-ec/knowledgex-decentralized-data-science-marketplace-implements-the-iexec-protocol-597f4864a8f6

from what i understand the only people that can see the data are the senders of said data because computer code just works on it and they get the $ and then the sender gets product.

>>53308864
Fair. What these people describes seems to work. But again this exists outside of the blockchain. Nobody is going to complicate things by adding the blockchain for no reason - there is zero benefit to doing this through the blockchain.
But really, I'm not saying your coin might not see success. But that success will be from the exact same reason a coin like dogecoin pumps. Stupid luck, constant shilling, and fancy but empty words are not something I would bet on.

>>53308891
>outside of the blockchain.
I think that's where you keep getting stuck. Outside doesnt matter to us

>>53308906
Considering the "outside" (such as robots or medical industries) is the use case for this coin, perhaps it should matter a little more to you, huh?

>>53308918
It doesn't matter in that it exists outside the blockchain because the blockchain is the only thing that matters.

>>53308918
Also there is a benefit to doing it through a blockchain. Being able to trustlessly rent anyone's PC or app or data seems extremely useful in an ever increasing data ownership problem world

>>53308960
Trustlessly? There is still trust since this is not entirely on the blockchain. The Trusted Execution Environment seems to be a more refined version of a concept that has existed for a while, but was never really developed thus far (after all, it's so much easier if you just buy full access to the data and call it a day). And while it is an interesting technology from what I've read, it's not perfect. And it is not on the blockchain, either. The blockchain just connects to these TEE's.

>>53308979
Yea trustlessly. Good luck breaking into a cpu and stealing the info you desire. I think it's been tried a lot before but they always patch the cpu or something

>>53308979
Also idk what you mean by "just buy full access to the data and call it a day" when that's what RLC lets you do in a decentralized way?

>>53303736
>My total portfolio in crypto and stocks is about 2.1 million. I'm a programmer who graduated with a bachelors 7 years ago and earns about 180k/year with an extra 15% of that added to a SEP IRA. I work from home and do maybe 20 hours of work a week. I live in an apartment that probably costs more per month than some of your friends and family make in a year./biz/ was never free of shills, but back in 2019 I feel like there were way less of this constant shilling and more actual crypto discussion. Third world faggots like you ruin things.

Crypto millionaire and still renting