/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>25324954
I went to school for microbiology, got my paper, no jobs. I switched to coding and took a bootcamp and now I work at microsoft.

>>25324954
The answer isn't going back to school you retard. Stop being a lazy piece of shit, fix your resume, and bullshit your way to an entry level position

Even the good jobs that exist in something like biochem are in elite academic labs. My friend works in one and her colleagues can accept making $34,000 in a major metro area because their families pay for their $4k/month studio, since they've been rich for decades. LOL

There's only 1 other teammate she can truly relate to, who deals with her own bills.

>>25324954
Apparently houre a retard. I made 138k in my 2nd year after graduating in 2017

>>25324982
What bootcamp did you join anon?

>>25324954
you could have just bought bitcoin with that college money and retire now

>>25324982

Are you a premier field engineer?

>>25324954
mech or EE?

>>25325611
>you could have just bought bitcoin with that college money and retire now
Exactly what norms will have to cope with

I graduated with a econ degree. Didn't like my job so went to bootcamp last year. Now make 90k in MCL area as a software engineer

>Falling for the education meme
You will reach more in 5 years job hopping then 20 years of combined education, and non of what you learned in 20 years will be relevant for anything you do.

Your master shitcourse will be as useless as your undergrad one

>>25327698
>You will reach more in 5 years job hopping then 20 years of combined education
This is correct.

I actually did precisely this, as a software engineer and I might be able to realistically exit the field in 2021, having hit my financial goals. Crypto gains really helped a lot.

Also, remember that $ stored at 20 can multiply by 88, by the time you are 65, with very conservative investing.

Age 25: wealth x 53
Age 30: 23
Age 35: 14.73
Age 55: 2

You can see how quickly this shit decays (although partially because 55-65 is 10 years vs 45 years)

Basically, my analysis is that one shouldn't fuck around too long trying to get a higher salary. I'd rather see someone make $50k/year and fucking invest than study their whole 20s to make $100k

Another takeaway would be at least look into the likelihood of another 2 years doing a master will pay off. If it's hard to analyze and you can't seem find a place-online or not- where aspirational people are talking about careers within the community of that masters program, you're likely in the wrong place or will have to be an entrepreneur. When I was studying computer science, I browsed a lot of /r/cscareerquestions

>>25324982
I did the same thing lmao only instead of learning to code I just became an alcoholic and gave up on life lol

>>25325150
flatiron, but I taught myself java before applying.
>>25326237
no
>>25328739
I had that phase too, I painted a lot.

>>25328739
Damn I didn't know it was that easy to get into Microsoft.

>>25328949
>Damn I didn't know it was that easy to get into Microsoft.
It's easier than you think to get into all of FAGMAN, depending on how well you can grok a specific set of problem types

>>25324954
Ill help anon. Apply at biotech, its the only industry hiring engineers

>>25328996
Wow I love FAGMAN!

>>25328663
master is money thrown out the window. There a whole bunch of gov programs filled with shitloads of tax money to pay for specific qualification for active persons. At least in Europe, in most cases it makes more sense to have your boss sign some papers for you to get free certifications worth thousands than to waste 2 years watching ivory tower academic masturbate in front of a class.

poorgineering is weird now, it somehow commands social respect despite the fact that salaries have been gutted by globalization.

>doing Finance in school
>learning tech stuff when not doing school
Literally only getting the degree for the fag legal reasons and certifications, tech stuff I'm teaching myself is way more valuable and will probably be the reason I get a job in the future

>He fell for the engineering meme

It takes a masters to even get an entry level engineering job. Enjoy working for 30k a year for 10 years grinding in the most tedious shit thatll make you wanna commit suicide.


Take it from someone who saw the engineering scam while in uni. Its a course for programmed retards to becoming full on chattel slaves

>>25325141
What field?

>>25325141
For everyman that makes this about 20 others are lining up for foodstamps

>>25324954
Did you do an internship?

>>25329597
The more I see STEM shit the more I feel bad for the people who take it in anything but a top school
Like you're just going to be outsourced lol
Either you find a way to work for yourself or you're just going to eat shit tbqh

>>25329807
Medicine is still good if you can do it. But engineering specifically is a well known meme

>>25324954
are you white, indian or asian ?

>>25324982
yeah biology is such a fucking meme. even if you get a job it'll be one for like 20k counting fish in a pond or something

>>25329807
Complete BS. I go to a shitty state school and plenty of people I know have good jobs after graduation. Maybe you should get off your ass and do something to compete with other grads instead of complaining and wishing you'd get a high paying job for free.

A good engineer is a good engineer and they will be in demand as long as we are building.

>>25324954
OP, learn how to do something on your own. If you fell for the "go to school and you'll get a good job just for getting good grades" then sorry.

A master's is probably not worth it. There are hobbies that fit the niche of most engineering majors. Do them and show them off. You'll get a job when someone sees that you actually give a shit.

Be creative dude.

>>25331378
>be miserable sitting in an office, reading and writing alien languages for soulless computers to read
>drive around in truck, pulling a dirty old boat, and comfy counting the fishes around the county all day

I know which one would make me more proud and happy.

>>25330713
Spend 10 more years going to med school now?
I should have fucking done pre-med atleast I had
a way out.

>>25331152
White Chad.

>>25331830
Other than launching my own scam consulting company that helps college students with their resumes or career advice I don't know what else to fucking do. Rip.

>>25324982
I desperately need to make this transition. Where should I start anon?

>>25329807
>The more I see STEM shit the more I feel bad for the people who take it in anything but a top school
Like you're just going to be outsourced lol
tell that to /g/ they know first hand about how hard getting cucked by tech outsourcing is

College is a meme at this point - only go if your parents will pay for it, or if you can afford it without going into debt.

>>25331999
Trips speaketh the truth

>>25331999
eh, I'm pretty proud of my side projects, ditzbitz.com
Especially this one http://ditzbitz.com/platformrpgoctopus.html
I keep plants and cyanobacteria and I make biosims sometimes, and I do miss it, but I also really do enjoy coding because I'm literally autistic.

>>25333285
What are the best majors in college?

>>25332351
I started by asking my brother who already knew java to help me get android studio set up and to put my phone in dev mode. He made me a quick calculator app and I started modifying it line by line until I understood what each line was doing. I wanted a base 60 calculator for a sci-fi book I was writing so I could get the alien math right. It took me months to get it working without bugs, and even then the functionality was limited. The calculator became the front screen to my first game: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ditzler.cole.stableapp&hl=en_US&gl=US

If I were starting over though, I would learn javascript. It's so much easier to develop in for several reasons. I built a similar calculator recently in javascript as practice and it took me less than an hour. http://ditzbitz.com/calculator.html.. Javascript may get a lot of flak, but its mostly from people who tried it years ago and don't realize how much it has increased in use and operational proficiency. Ruby is also a good place to start, but WILL NOT get you a job. It's just a baby's first programming language that lets you get your feet wet. I've heard the same thing about python but I don't use python so I'm unsure. Good luck my dude, maybe start with a html5 canvas/javascript app. If you want a project to dismantle, my github has a lot https://github.com/Packmanager9, including an engine for web toys/games.

>>25333285
>or if you can afford it without going into debt

This is what I'm currently doing. Maybe it will all be for naught in the end, but I like to debate people and hate when they point to my level of education to discredit me.

>>25333729
Thanks dude. I really appreciate the response

>>25333854
>they point to my level of education to discredit me
anyone who does this is automatically wrong. Now with the internet, a kid coming into highschool could know more about any given single topic than someone 4 times their age who actually went to school for it decades ago.

>>25333633

It doesn't really matter what you pick since you likely won't be doing that type of work after your graduate anyway.

>>25324982
I'm genuinely curious how the software market will look for you guys a few years from now. With the pandemic fucking people over, you'll definitely see a surge in people trying to lrn2code. Will be interesting to see.

>>25333899
you're welcome :)
>>25333729
also, the game is called 'Can You Defeat StockMania" Because the first part of the game is a stock market simulator. May be relevant to /biz/ interests, obviously the game is free and no ads. The only person who ever downloaded it was my dad lol.

>>25333936
You know how it is, people will grasp at whatever they can to make themselves feel better. I always remind myself that the purpose is to convince the people listening, not the person on the other side.

>have 2 sisters and 1 brother
>we all go to college
>brother and I get Finance and Construction Management degrees respectively
>sisters get polysci degrees
>dad pays for all of our college
>bro and I were the only ones who found jobs right out of school, while sisters remained jobless for several years after

Why are women so fucking dumb?

>>25334053
Kek. I know women with history degrees who are pulling pulling 6 figures in corporate 'consulting' jobs 2-3 years out of unergrad. The only dudes I know who couldn't find jobs were CS, finance and math majors. pajeets can just replace your ass, you need those soft skills nigga

>>25334032
>I always remind myself that the purpose is to convince the people listening
this guy gets it. Arguments are performance art.
>>25334007
it is interesting, but I'm pretty damn sure there is more tech debt in the world than all the devs or potential devs could fix in a lifetime. There is a lot of work to do, even AI won't close the gap without a lot of work hours. Plus more services keep popping up, apps, etc, they need constant tending. I think it will be a while before the industry saturates, but the first sign with be stagnant wages.

>>25334114
You can’t function in my industry without soft skills, so i’m set there

>>25334119
>I think it will be a while before the industry saturates, but the first sign with be stagnant wages.
And I'm only considering the possibility of people attending bootcamps. I don't know how many people graduate per year as comp sci and other shit, but I imagine this will be ramped up 2x -3x within the next 5 years globally.

>>25328857
which subject/course did you follow anon?

>>25334243
probably, yeah. Good thing we're all balls deep in crypto.

>>25334287
>subject/course
in school? Microbiology Major/Botany major with a Plant Pathology focus/Chemistry minor. I would have had three majors and a minor, but I graduated a year early to save money since the third major would have just been 'Biological Sciences' which I consider lesser to Microbiology anyway.

For the coding, I literally just fucked with the code until I understood, I never even though to google anything until months into the process. After that though, flat iron bootcamp.

>>25334344
the bootcamp I mean. It offers several courses for different prices

>>25334344
I already know java so if I'm doing a bootcamp I need to consider which industry will be worth it

>>25324954
Engineering is a shit discipline. I'm not an engineer but I've worked at two companies in two different different supply chain layers. I have worked alongside people with electrical, mechanical and chemical engineering degrees. You don't want to work at either of those companies and extrapolating from that I can only imagine every other company involved in every single supply chain is equally shitty in its own way. The best thing you can do with your degree is get into technical sales. The company will undoubtedly suck but it's a lucrative and a chad position.

i graduated from CS in May with multiple industry projects and an internship at a fortune 100 company and i'm 0 for 60 on resume submissions. thinking about getting off of this ride soon

>>25324954
what kind of Engineering?

>>25324954
>get to eat beans and rice for an additional 2 years before having to diversify your diet so as to not look like a total NEET

Why are you not celebrating this? Black beans and white rice is the best dish in the world. Are you cooking your beans too long?

>>25334456
Engineering disciplines your mind to be an efficient problem solver in every aspect of life. The profession blows, but the skills you gain are Invaluable

>>25334456
>>25334619


Engineering degree here, started working at a hedge fund right after university and am still at one. The background definitely comes in handy in plenty of situations

>>25334738
Hows pay? Age?

>>25334481

CS has been flooded with pajeets for many year now. Trump was supposed to shut down H1b's but he cucked out.

>>25334786
Pay is quite good and I started off at a single manager fund, so bonus wasn't too wildly affected by performance because the management fee was enough to provide good comp to everyone with or without a huge performance fee windfall. My starting base was $110k and I typically had a $150k bonus. Moved to a multi manager fund and now I'm titled a "senior analyst", bit narrower focus than I'd like but I still have the freedom to do my own idea generation and research. Base is $230k and bonus is at least that in a normal year but usually closer to $300k.

28 in two weeks

>>25334934
what skills do you need to work at a hedge fund. I have an chemical engineering degree from MIT and am working in a research lab currently. I love the job and have >30 publications. Unfortunately the pay is modest and I don't see myself ever being promoted any higher.

>>25334799
Yeah. Earth's ruined. Gonna end it in minecraft

>>25334556
i fucking love rice in an unhealthy way. i could chow plain white rice.

>>25334380
oh I understand now, software engineering.

>>25324954
>chooses not to actually learn the skill in a field that requires you to actually have and use the knowledge.
>doesn’t get a job and gets mad.

Yeah, anon, not sure how to tell you this. You might want to get checked out for intellectual disabilities.

>>25324954
>studying eng instead of cs

>>25324954

Its funny how “smart people” go to school, debt, slavery for 100 fucking k a year!

I juat laugh and shake my head as my ecomm store makes me 275k a year and its not like Im even working. Its just kinda fun haha. I guess im happy I studied entrepreneurship and had an internet marketing meet up here in my city to ask questions to successful people. Its just painful watching people ruin their lives when all they need is some upfront work and having an actual success road map, not the fake poor road map that your parents, teachers, schools, governments brainwash you with in the matrix.

Owell though.... I guess the world needs slaves too.

>>25335045
I think breaking into the industry is hard for a lot of people, I basically just got lucky with accidentally meeting the guy that later became my boss at the single manager fund. I've only been in the industry for six years, and I've only worked at two funds, so take all of this with a big grain of salt.

For what I do, which is 80% value-based equities research and 20% alternative strategies, an ability to conduct excellent research on ideas relatively fast is probably the main thing. This is something you can get practice with now very easily - just start reading the 10-K's of any stock you're interested in and take notes as you do.

I'd also say that you need to be diligent-enough, or "autistic" in the lingo of /biz/, to be able to nit pick every little thing in an idea. Some would probably call this "creativity" but I think it's more appropriate to call it paranoia. I once looked at a company whose management were touting that a new facility was going to be finished sooner than they anticipated, but their tone on the earnings call saying this sounded like they were up to shenanigans so I got satellite imagery of the site and read up on basic construction site management one night. Came to the conclusion that the facility was not going to be finished early and may actually be delayed, which would cause a price decline to a level that was more attractive. Another time I was researching a tech company whose 10-K was basically a buzz word bonanza that never really explained what the fuck they do. They had a fancy term to describe their business that was basically meant to obfuscate the fact that they were full of shit, so I went to the wikipedia page for that term and sure enough the IP address where most of the edits were coming from was right by their HQ.

Other things:
>Be good at math
>Having some basic programming competency will save a ton of time in your workflow
>STRONG communication skills

you will make it.

>>25324954
>didnt do internships
>didnt do undergrad research
>didnt make connections
>HURR WHY NO JOBS FOR ME??? STEM SUX!!!!

>>25334934
Damn, this is sobering. I design infrastructure for the world to use, 12yrs in as a civil engineer and I make 75k.

>>25335376
This sounds like the perfect job for me. I'm a mega autist when it comes to details and also did a math minor and use python for my research. Never worked with big data sets though.

>>25334481
see this is what i'm talking about lol >>25334292

>>25335376
I left out probably the most important skill: an insatiable curiosity. As faggy as that sounds, it's probably the one thing I see that consistently separates good performers from mediocre or bad ones.

>>25335459
I know it's a lot easier for me to say but money isn't everything. I'm blessed to be as fortunate as I am but I truly love what I do and I would do it even if I was making $60k a year. I don't really spend money on anything except helping my family with their expenses. I drive a used camry, live in a $1200/month apartment (kinda cheap for the city I'm in), don't own a single article of clothing worth more than $80 and most of my clothes are from Marshall's or Gap, I don't drink so I don't waste money on $15 rum and coke's or expensive liquors, and I try to cook my own meals as much as I can (though I have gotten lazier with this recently).

I completed an internship at the fund I eventually started at after university before I actually went to go work for them. I did a lot of soul searching after they made me a full time offer to see if I really wanted to do this. What I'm getting at is that money, beyond what you need to live a relatively safe and comfortable life, really isn't that important. Call me a fag, but I think health, family, and happiness are really the most important things in life. It's just nice to have extra put away, but it's not remotely necessary to be happy.

>>25335715
If you want to go the quant route (which most STEM-background people do, but not me) then you'll definitely have a relatively easy time getting your foot in the door. I think they do a ton of very interesting stuff but I just prefer doing more traditional discretionary analysis.

>>25335796
>an insatiable curiosity
this is what I love about my current job. I can't not do research. I'm constantly testing random hypotheses and working late into the night.

What job title should I search for when looking for positions?

>>25335045
> yfw MIT grads on biz
kek

>>25324954
Browse /sci/ for a few months. People keep idolizing engineering careers thinking they are going to make it if they major in their field, at this point I really think any career choice given out by the middle class is just a scam to live a mild comfortable life. My career choice is a meme, an Industrial chemist so I'm basically a glorified yogurt maker. Might be better than your common wages lave but what really matters is investing your paycheck in the right places. We've been born poor, meme degrees won't get us anywhere but what really matters is how we invest our paychecks, so don't give up bros.

>>25335940
>mfw I become a nuclear reactor operator at 19 years old and make 150k a year without a degree
>no face

>>25335902
If you're going the discretionary route, it's a bit more rigid in that you'll almost certainly start out as a junior analyst and then you get advanced after a couple years to analyst or senior analyst. "Junior Analyst" or "Analyst" are probably the most appropriate if you're searching around job listing sites.

If you want to go the quant route, I'm not very informed on how career progression works in that arena but I think most shops tend to split their quants into either "Traders" and "Researchers". My understanding is that "Traders" are responsible for building and maintaining the algo trading platforms. I think the majority of work here is in the realm of high freq. trading or market making - good US funds doing this, that I know of, include Jane Street, Belvedere Trading, and Chicago Trading Company. "Researchers" tend to be leveraging software techniques, typically ML-type stuff, to identify high level trends / patterns that may present good opportunities. Don't know too much about the specifics of what they do though, but I'm sure you could find at least a couple real quants here and a fuckload of them on a place like WSO.

Am I pretty much fucked if I graduate with zero internships cuz of my shitty gpa? Next career fair Im gonna go in and basically tell everyone ill work for free, Im a senior now and really running out of time

>>25336160
you might actually luck out from timing. i think economy booms in 21

>>25336160
Just go to grad school desu

>>25335362
kys retard

guys how fucked am I, I have free university at a state school (my mistake it's the only school I applied to because defeatism), I took my first semester off, and they want me back next semester because they are paying for it, I am in chemical engineering but everyone is saying it's a meme and it won't likely get me anywhere, do I go back, do I change my degree path, or do stay home and weep over Uniswap money until I neck myself?

>>25336003
wtf. what are you doing on biz!!!
>>25336160
don't cuck yourself, anon.

>>25335796
Happiness comes in many colors. Solid advice. Ambition goes a long way too, I know its tiresome to say, but if you want it bad enough you can get what you want.

>>25336455
Checked. I agree with you wholeheartedly

>>25335376
this is such a schizo post, i love it. this kind of stuff sounds really exciting to execute but you also gotta be super well informed and willing to go beyond, which is probably the hardest part
honestly its the kind of stuff you were born with, theres no learning how to be a paranoic person that trusts nothing and always looks over the shoulder. while i do have these behaviours, im also extremely lazy and addicted to the feeling of having something important to do and not doing it.
im graduating as a chem eng next year and if it wasnt for the fact that my dad owned a big lab chain that he built by himself and is the sole owner, and im set up to lead it after i graduate, i would be totally hopeless.

>>25336432
I am super autistic and have no friends in real life, that's why.
I come to biz to try to catch good advice like the stuff in this thread.
The only reason I have the job is because I am great at it, and I memorized
every single procedure to handle any accident aka "casualty" that may happen
in the plant. My coworkers despise me because I have no social skills
and make the room super awkward and uncomfortable to be in.
I just stay quiet now, because I don't look like an autist but if I talk,
they know.

>>25336576
>My coworkers despise me because I have no social skills and make the room super awkward and uncomfortable to be in
lmao I'm the same exact way

>>25329807
And they laughed when I have no qualifications and decided to grab a shovel. now have an 80k + job, 1hr break a day, sleep in the car now and then and a stronger immune system lol@ uni retards

Top kek clown world

>>25333395
Impressive, gj anon.

>>25334481
Same here. CS is already stagnating, idk wtf anons here are talking about. It's incredibly competitive. I working knowledge of Python, Java, JS, R, SQL, React, HTML/CSS and prob like five other things I'm forgetting, and I barely get calls back.
Don't listen to people who get into the industry five years ago, a lot of the willingness to compromise for junior devs is gone. If you don't know what to do in life and just what a growth industry, tech is still a good choice, but it's not easy money anymore, people used to get coding jobs knowing only SQL.

>>25337732
Just become a teacher then and scam the next generation.

>>25336388
Just change programs. ChemE a) doesn't involve much chemistry, b) is mostly tied to the oil industry (aka dying) and c) is even pretty distant from other fields of engineering except mech (it's basically applied thermodynamics).
Remember, you aren't in school to "do what you love," you're there in invest in your future. Do commerce, CS, finance, IT or EE. Almost every other major is hot garbage.

>>25336221
How so? I should mention im an international student in US so theres a lot more restrictions since companies have to sponsor me. I hope joe biden changes that

>>25337732
>tech is still a good choice, but it's not easy money anymore, people
You should try using your tech skills and doing something biz related.

>>25334053
It's not women being dumb it's just that they're floundering about barely keeping afloat because normally they would immediately be married off after or before reaching adulthood, so now they have no idea what to do so they just mcdonalds charge dey phone twerk be bisexual eat hot chip and lie

>>25337850
>b) is mostly tied to the oil industry (aka dying) and c) is even pretty distant from other fields of engineering except mech (it's basically applied thermodynamics)
Oh sweet summer child, ChemE is all about materials science and non-petroleum chemistries nowadays. It's changed a LOT in the past decade.

>>25336240
Im an industrial engineering major, what do you think is a good graduate program to get into? Im thinking engineering management

>>25336003
Nice try you nigger

A close friend of mine graduated with a masters in engineering. He was the biggest chad in uni. He was the head of the boxing club and beat several people and fucked a shitton of women

Right after graduating he got a job at a nuclear reactor. They have him looking at fucking graphs all day for 25k a year. He wants to kill himself.

Engineering is a massive fucking scam. A dream sold to capable but naive people.

>>25336003
is it anything like this: http://ditzbitz.com/reactor.html

>>25324954
too late to quit now

>>25324954
Masters degree preferred.

>>25324954
i dropped out of community college to take a software developer apprenticeship (web dev). that was 4 years ago, today i am a tech lead/senior dev
college is for retards, enjoy your debt and a life of being in debt

>>25340521
surprised you haven't been outsourced yet. nice anon.

>>25339685
living like a chad from 0 to age 25 is worth billions anyway