/biz/ - Business & Finance

t. retard who cant into math

Yes, taxes gradually rise until a given area collapses into chaotic anarchy and total freedom. Then the process starts over again as stationary bandits re-establish themselves as government.

See, for example, ISIS.

>>24791993
the money you have has been taxed to death.

>>24791995
any good historical references I can read about ?

>>24792010
i hate billionaires for spending more money on people the government should be in charge of everything ban people
>lefties

>>24791975
Did you just start paying attention to the world today or some shit? Do you have any idea how absolutely fucking insane all of this shit currently is and will become?

>>24792014
>In his final book, Power and Prosperity (2000), Olson distinguished between the economic effects of different types of government, in particular, tyranny, anarchy, and democracy. Olson argued that under anarchy, a "roving bandit" only has the incentive to steal and destroy, whilst a "stationary bandit"—a tyrant—has an incentive to encourage some degree of economic success as he expects to remain in power long enough to benefit from that success. A stationary bandit thereby begins to take on the governmental function of protecting citizens and their property against roving bandits. In the move from roving to stationary bandits, Olson sees the seeds of civilization, paving the way, eventually for democracy, which by giving power to those who align with the wishes of the population, improves incentives for good government.[5] Olson's work on the roving vs. stationary bandits is influential in analysis of the political and economic order structured in warlord states and societies.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mancur_Olson#Legacy

taxation is the reason so many working people are poor

>>24792237
I mean the injustice of it cannot be stressed enough. Laborers lose close to half their income after federal, state, sales tax and healthcare premiums. On top of that they have their bills and debt and maybe a mortgage if they’re lucky enough to own the place they live in (which they pay huge property taxes on, too). These are people who perform backbreaking labor every day, making society function, and society repays them by draining all of their money through obligatory costs that do not benefit them in any tangible way. I don’t understand why this horrible injustice is not the fixation of tax reform. Instead the focus is kept entirely on the billionaire bogeyman while the random worker on the street just keeps bleeding out financially from the enormous tax burden he already carries and which leftists just want to make even more onerous

>>24791975
An "economy" where each time you interact, half of the value goes to useless government programs.

>>24792314
You got it

>>24792314
>"WE WILL TAX THE RICH"
>Rich evade taxes
>Government must tax the poor/middleclass to deal with higher spending(corruption)
>Repeat

>>24791995
This guy gets it. For fucks sakes. Thank god someones gets it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTHRg_iSWzM

>>24792314
The steelman argument is the government "handles" the long term planning for the person's retirement or unexpected disability. It also shoulders the burden of defending people from criminals and enemy armies.

So by paying taxes the wagie can wage in peace, never having to think 50 miles away from home or 50 years away from the present.

>>24791975

You aren't supposed to have money, you are supposed to play fetch with it.

Money is a tool of enslavement. That's why the IRS wants you to pay them in US dollars. They want to force you to use their currency that they control. Earn in bitcoin, pay out with US dollars.

>>24792237
They reason they are poor is because they work for other people and are not business owners. They deserve to be taxed because they don't contribute anything else to society, yet utilise everything which society is constructed of, such as roading and infrastructure. Business owners pay (if they want to) minimal tax because that is their incentive for contributing to society. The wealthy by owning property and businesses provide everything the poor need to survive, jobs, housing, security, etc. These are the things which society is comprised of, and poor people ie employees don't contribute any of it, they only consume these services.

Taxation may be theft, yes, but you have the option of being on the right side of it and making it work for you. Capitalism is an extension of the Law of the Jungle God has laid out for the Universe to operate according to, except in a way it is more equal because it not dependent on your physical gifts, but your mental gifts, so you can succeed even if you are weak, as long as you have initiative.

This is what the poors cannot understand and why they are poor. Poverty is a state of mind, a slavery mindset, a mental illness of undeserved entitlement.

>>24792196
nice post, nice id

>>24791975
government is incompetent with money, corruption and also Jewish
/thread

>>24792569
True

>>24792585
It's literally impossible for everyone to be a business owner

>>24792613
Correct. This is the law of the Jungle. Not everyone can be the Lion.

This is how God has created the Universe. This is life at every level of existence.

>>24792585
>>24792623
the most Jewish thing I’ve read today, kudos

>>24792654
Invoking the kike boogeyman does not give your thinly veiled communist sympathizing more credibility. Equality is not real and attempting to enforce it is always done by destruction and deconstruction, that is why every iteration of communism always results mass graves. It is anti life. It is Satanic.

>>24792685
>not wanting socialists to assrape the middle class and distribute their money to niggers is communist

>>24792623
I'd disagree with the notion that they deserve to be taxed. They provide necessary services for society to function. A owner of a plumbing business is nothing without having plumbers to employ.
If anything, the top, the parasitic class who does nothing but move paper around for profit deserves to be taxed into oblivion.
The working people are literally the least useless. The investors/bankers and the freeloaders on welfare are a burden.

>>24792585
Are you a business owner?

I think we should shift our mindset here to an entrepreneurial one. Everyone from the laborer, doctor, to business owner is an entrepreneur selling their services. The entrepreneur has trained their mind to look for opporunities whilst the rest going to school or working jobs have trained their minds to be good employees. Isn't it smart to avoid paying taxes, which is essentially theft?

>>24791975
Money isn't taxed because technically you don't really own the money. The state provides you with money as a physical representation of some form of value. Usually, whenever money changes hands, it's because some sort of new value is created e.g. you grinding through excel sheets for Mr. Sheckelstein or him selling some shitty chocolate bar at 500% mark-up. The state taxes the new value that was created. I guess there is an exception though with inheritance and gifting money to someone

>>24792719
>make up ridiculously unrelated strawman
Cool I guess

>>24792733
>>24792733
>If anything, the top, the parasitic class who does nothing but move paper around for profit deserves to be taxed into oblivion.
People who operate businesses provide value to society and provide the hierarchy of society itself. People should be incentivized to do this, and they are, through tax breaks for business. If there was no incentive to do this and people were disincentivized to do this by being obliterated through tax in spite of their disproportionate initiative, extreme hard work, and acceptance of all the financial risk in operating these businesses above and beyond what a layman employee accepts responsibility for, then there would be point for them to do so, and they would not, resulting in a debased society without great enterprise or splendor and one which is reliant on the state.

Where bankers are concerned, being that they move money around for profit but provide seemingly little additional value to society, it's not unreasonable to surmise that these people "deserve" to be taxed more highly I guess, but a) they are, b) this is difficult to enforce so there's still ways around it, c) this still doesn't achieve equity or parity with the impoverished, you are just outright punishing people for their initiative, which is at least as destructive and unproductive as them making money by moving it around, or arguably moreso because of the moral precedent created by this type of thinking. "Sure he used his mind to get it, but I say he doesn't DESERVE IT as much (insert nigger here), LET'S STEAL HIS MONEY AND GIVE IT TO THE NIGGERS! (so they have more money to spend on meth and gambling and porn and alcohol and fleeting material consumerism)"

It’s almost like we live in a state that requires lots of public expenditure for the water we drink, roads we drive on, public education we receive, police to run the streets, fire department to protect life and property, army protect our interests, judges who enforce the law.


You think this runs for free?

>>24792875
in all your rambling you still haven’t explained your reasoning why you think the government should tax people at exorbitant rates

> yet utilise everything which society is constructed of, such as roading and infrastructure
this comprises around 1% of the federal budget and even this could be accomplished more efficiently by the market and not by the government that wastes thousands of dollars to incorrectly patch a single pothole

>>24792789
>. Isn't it smart to avoid paying taxes, which is essentially theft?
Definitely.

My take is don't hate the game, hate the player. Tax exists for a real reason, but you should still try to avoid it. Tax is like a scrub filter, if you can't pass it then get wrecked faggot, but if you pay $0 in tax then congratulations, you achieved what everyone else wishes they could. The thing is most business owners can't avoid paying tax at all but most can use tax laws to their advantage, and should be.

If you a a wagie, then save your money as capital and use your spare time to develop a business plan, and go out there and seize the day, like a Tiger, go take what the weak and stupid cannot and do not deserve. If you would rather be a wagie and spend all your money and time on entertainment bread and circuses, oh well, have fun self medicating your depression about choosing to be a slave.

>>24792918
you think any of that requires taxing the workforce 50% of their income? Look up at what the federal budget goes toward

>>24792940
Yeah, it’s almost like we live in a society and one of the things we provide is a pension for people who have worked their entire life.

>>24792926
>why you think the government should tax people at exorbitant rates
I don't think they should tax people at exorbitant rates, but I can understand why they do; because they can. But if tax is necessary for public works, then government should be as small as functionally possible and tax should be as low as possible, in my moral estimation. Being that the purpose of government is to subjugate a population and essentially farm them for resources like slaves, obviously they're going to push that as far as they can get away with. That's unfortunate, but you still have the option of minimising the damage they want to do to you. You cannot change the existance of government or taxation, but you can avoid it if you are determined. It's up to each individual to confront that and to help others in their community to do so as well.

But saying viva revolution let's destroy everything until we deconstruct the hierarchy is not a solution. The solution is for the wise to take responsibility for themselves. That's you if you want it to be. And for the people who do not have the eyes to see to perish under taxation.

Equality is not real. Life is cruel and violent.

>>24792196
where this analogy falls apart is distinguishing between monarchies vs democracies.

In a monarchy, the "stationary bandit" (ie. king) has ownership of the land. Therefore there is strong incentive for him to maximize its value since ultimately he will pass it down to his kin.

In a democracy, the politicians only have a temporary rent of power. Therefore the incentive becomes to maximize short term gain and strip out all value immediately. After a few hundred years of successive strip mining, the area becomes worthless.

Democracies are a terrible idea and always collapse.

>>24792196
trash.
all government in decline will strip its resource base to stay in power

>>24793006
you’re a very tedious person who rambles about god and communists at the slightest provocation, nothing you wrote was interesting or useful

>>24791975
Singed main checking in

>>24793018
I agree to some extent. Democracy to me is almost antithetical to useful individualistic capitalism due to the fact that capitalism rewards initiative while democracy is a nullification of that desire to seize and conquer; where successive government is determined by flaccid populist compromizes which debase the responsibility of leadership rather than being determined by bold seizures based on initiative and vision.

>>24793151
Every communist sympathizer, every Jew, and every intelligence officer WILL be executed by firing squad. How does that make you feel? How do you feel to know that you work will account for nothing because your ideology is bankrupt?

>>24792918
>the water we drink
i pay a water bill, nothing to do with taxes
>roads we drive on
private roads would be better
>public education we receive
indoctrination is good for you goy
>police to run the streets
defund the rayciss police!
>fire department to protect life and property
you got me there
>army protect our interests
starting unnecessary wars
>judges who enforce the law
they don't do this at all

>>24791975
Money is infrastructure which allows easy exchange of goods and services
Every time you use that infrastructure, you need to pay a fee

>>24792992
social security is a ponzi scheme and the ror on the money you put into ss is worse than a savings account.

>>24792196
The problem is that representative democracy is a bunch of roving bandits.
Bring back constitutional monarchy.

>>24793018
elected democratic leaders are just puppets for the masses. In western-style "democracies", oligarchs hold the real power, and they have an invested interest in upholding the system