/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>24578357
people will stop buying government bonds. then the shitconomy will crap itself. argentina 2.0

>>24578357
yea i don't really understand what the fed thinks its doing. maybe they don't have a choice
>any kind of interest rate hike will cause credit markets to seize up
>endless QE devalues currency
>countries will start dumping our treasuries
>fed increasingly becomes the only buyer of US debt
>pure debt monetization and accelerating erosion of currency
>coupled with stagnating wages and there will just be an erosion of living standards

what is a liquidity trap btw?

>>24578538
So the US will just monetize its debt via the FED

>>24578633
yeah until the jig (or as i like to say nig) is up

>>24578623
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p47uvsjB5E0

>>24578357
banks shouldn't be giving out loans to any retard who knows how to sign a contract. everyone else has to pay higher interest rates because of subhumans who default on their loans. thus if you want interest rates to remain low, you should support banks being stringent about who their loan money.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8zfz0EbcZA\\

these guys think we are basically years behind japan, who have been doing Qe for a while too

>>24578623
a liquidity 'trap' is how keynesians describe the obvious results of their interventions. tl;dr its when lowering interest rates no longer does shit because people stopped caring

>>24578706
7 years*

>>24578706
yeah japan seems to have speedrunned a (and i hate to use this term) 'late stage capitalism' or 'post-ford' western economy. we're doing the exact same thing just slower

>>24578685
>banks shouldn't be giving out loans to any retard who knows how to sign a contract.
but the central bank wants that because it stimulates the economy.

>>24578706
The one big difference though is that Japan's economy is a lot more exclusive to its locals. Foreigners aren't allowed to buy property and companies in Japan like they are in much of the Western world, nor do they have runaway immigration, both of which substantially increase velocity of money and speculation.

>>24578780
Are loans directly from the Fed via fed account and cbdcs the next logical step then?

>>24578786

You gotta watch this.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5-IZZxyb1GI

>>24578357
youll never get my link

>>2457878
6are you sure?

https://japanpropertycentral.com/real-estate-faq/can-a-foreigner-purchase-property-in-japan/

would lower taxes be better than stimulus?

>>24578949
i do think so
and UBI

>>24578685
banks dont give out loans because in most cases its more worthwhile for them to loan that money to the federal reserve. this is only because interest rates are so low. if rates were higher then banks would be more willing to put loans out

>>24578949
absolutely not
UBI increases liquidity and pumps money into the economy much better than lowering taxes, as well as bolstering the free market through more consumer options
take a look at tax rates and economic recessions and maybe you'll see the patterns

in either case UBI will become necessary as more and more jobs are obsolesced.

>>24578357
Why would /they/ let the middle class capitalise on lowrates when the whole covid scamdemic is designed to ruin them?

>>24578623
>maybe they don't have a choice
Yeah. They surely didn't cause this on purpose.

>>24578357
Interest rates are low because of the fed. The reason why loans are harder to get is because the banks that have all the money to loan cannot find what they deem to be responsible and qualified businesses or individuals that can afford to pay back the principle. All the banks are aware that the economy is in the shitter and that people are losing their jobs and are at risk of foreclosure, they’re not going to loan money to those people.

>>24579013
>>24579169
do you think ubi could happen in the next decade in the us? a large amount of americans are hyper afraid of socialism in any form

>>24578357
No reason to risk if there is no reward, basic econ

>>24579537
>hyper afraid of socialism
>see 1500$ every month in bank account
>pic related

>>24579836
buys 2 loaves of bread for $20

>NYT
Worthless garbage OP, find a real article.

>>24579537
UBI is not socialism
>>24580400
it does not increase the money supply

the fact that people believe UBI is socialist and/or hyperinflationary tells that it will not be adopted by the US anytime soon haha

I can collateral my crypto for 0% interest loans who gives a fuck about nocoin niggers

>>24580517
>it does not increase the money supply
Ok dumbass, then where will all of that money come from?
Taxes? LOL. Not happening.

>>24578357
loans arent harder for amazon or apple. theyre paying the same as treasuries

>>24580735
depends who you ask, but that's the general idea...
like i said i dont think itll be adopted. i didnt even say i was advocating for it, just that it will be necessary in the future

>>24580735
we have to think different

https://www.amazon.de/FREEDOM-TAXES-Introduction-Automated-Transaction/dp/1077928572

>>24578538
>people will stop buying government bonds
Lol this is already the case. The fed buys something like half

>>24579537
UBI was an idea that came out of libertarian circles to consolidate welfare programs and make it more fair. This is why the original UBI advocates are so insistent that even Bill Gates would get a check every month.
I'm still not saying it's a good idea or a bad idea (I'd need to see actual policy for that), but calling it socialist is FUD by center-right wingers who love big government when it comes to killing brown people and getting their social security benefits, but put on a small government face whenever their immediate interests aren't being addressed.

>>24578623
>endless QE devalues currency
no real evidence of this (yet). DXY has generally trended up since 2008.

>>24578843
probably. there is already proposed legislation for this. Banking For All Act

>>24581061

Wasn't the Milton Friedman way to introduce UBI as a flat, non inflation adjusted stimulus that everyone can get. You would also need to remove all entitlement programs as the idea is that you are going to 'choose' your entitlement and benefits (or coom) with that money.

Similar concept with school vouchers to introduce competition and improve education through a marketplace with family's choosing their education vs public schools idling with tax payer funding anyways.

>>24581061
The problem here is, and always will be, that stupid people who can tolerate subsistence lifestyles will reproduce far more and far faster than anyone else.

You can't change that.

>>24578538
So what do. Invest in crypto? Just stack cash?

Killing 20 million niggers would have the same economic effect as providing UBI to 200 million Americans for 100 years.

>>24581500
Cash? Fuck no anon that shit's toilet paper in a year or two. Crypto, precious metals, guns, ammo, arable land. That's what you need to be stacking.

>>24581500
Legal firearms, think of the Tarcov economy my friend

>>24581474
That's why UBI would only be for people over 18. No incentives

>>24580400
I pay $7 per loaf of bread. But I have Celiac disease

>>24581474
would better more available education help counteract this? or some way to prevent bright minds from falling into desolation

>>24581668
education,as it is today, is a meme

hey smart people. just tell me what to do. buy crypto? gold? take out loans? sit on cash and invest when a crash comes? thnx

>>24581702
well then how should we change it ? imagining the education system collapsed tomorrow what do we do the day after to rebuild? i think a big part of America becoming a superpower was other countries exporting their best and brightest for our colleges.

>>24579537
maybe if we didnt have 25T in debt

UBI is probably for countries with money lmao

>>24581640
this seems like maybe a good idea, you mean people wouldn't receive more for more dependents?

>>24581764
If you're literally that stupid get on onlyfans and post nudes.

Women will trade blowjobs for lighters and kindle. Having a chicken will literally be the golden goose. As you will have eggs. Niggers will literally revert to hunting in packs like God intended and a new world will emerge.

>>24578717
Same as secular stagnation or quantitative easing, keynsians create names to hide their bullshit

>>24581770
maybe this will help

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna,_die_Schule_und_der_liebe_Gott

>>24578357
So they just want to repeat policy from the Clinton/Greenspan 90’s that led to the Great Recession. Keep rates low, make it super easy to get loans.

>>24581964
>make it super easy to get loans

except, it isn't easy as stated above

UBI is just colored up welfare.

And as a right winger, you can take my SS away, i didnt ask for it. Just give me every cent i paid into it back and we’ll call it good. I will also demand my employer give me a 6% raise and i will match that 6% of my own salary to invest in the stock market. Game set match.

>>24581474
you should have to pass various tests like not being a racist to get UBI.
You should at least have to prove you are at a healthy BMI before getting UBI. If you can't be trusted to maintain a healthy body why should the state trust you to have healthy finances? In that case you should be sent off to be a rich persons serf.

>>24581988
Right, because the Great Recession forced banks to be more scrupulous about who they lend to. Now we’ve come full circle with the NYT whining about it being “too hard” to get a loan.

>>24582017
One of the arguments for UBI is that it would actually be cheaper than all of the current social programs. That’s assuming that our clowns in DC could come to a consensus to implement UBI while also illuminating all current social and welfare programs. If that could be done then I think it’s a better option than what we do right now.

>>24578357
watch The Money Masters 3.5hr full documentary on youtube if you want to make it.

>>24582081
I’m open to it being a replacement, sure.

And people on UBI should not be able to have more than 1 child.

>>24582081
And we all know that the communists in DC want to implement UBI as an adjunct to current social programs, not a replacement. Anything to keep the lowest among us stitched up tighter to the government cock.

>>24582115
The "U" in "UBI" stands for "Universal", everyone gets it

>>24582202
Oh, right, well then we’d have to figure out something else to halt reproduction rates in communities completely dependent on the government

>>24581819
exactly.

Otherwise there would be households with 15+ children living like kings from UBI, doing nothing

>>24578859
thanks for sharing this