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2014762 No.2014762 [Reply] [Original]

So since 2011-2012, we've seen a huge decline in the price of commodities, especially since late 2014 when oil prices started tanking. How much of this decline is due to increased supply and how much of it is due to decreased demand? Looking at a recession like 2008, commodity prices cratered during that period as well, could we be seeing something similar if we have such a prolonged commodities glut?

>> No.2015105

>>2014762
Not a trader here but I'm in Oil & Gas. From what we know (or at least what we are told) increased technology in production including multi-well pads and horizontal hydraulic fracturing has created a huge increase in supply while also reducing capex and opex costs of production. Operators are holding off on big opportunities like deepwater for the easy money (shale plays). This is like a catch 22 though because operators have more control over supply and ultimately price than they did before. OPEC the international "cartel" still affect prices but not to the extent they used to. Shale limits their ability to control price to a certain extent.

This is a blessing and a curse depending on your perspective. On one hand, the market has more control over price and output. On the other hand, prices may stay low for quite awhile.

>> No.2015128

>>2015105
Interesting info.

So is it fair to say that supply is not being centrally controlled right now but instead is a result of individual actors responding to market conditions?

How worried is OPEC? I've heard they intentionally flooded supply to make alternative drilling methods unprofitable but have not seen any concrete proof of that.

>> No.2015276

We need so much more commodity info here

>> No.2015350
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2015350

>>2014762
Various Commodities markets have been like atm for me

>>2015128
OPEC have lost control ages ago

>> No.2015386

>>2015128
>OPEC
New to biz, but can tell you right now, if they tried to flood the market, it'd only hurt them in the short and long.

The Donald's fucking around with making the US ME oil independent has been a massive nightmare for them, literal worse case scenario for them, and now with the Keystone Pipeline, Fracking opening up more, the possibility of a Mexican revolution opening up the massive reserves on land, and the loosening on the Gulf regulations, they lose the US for oil.

Europe is hard to say. They're definitely looking to go straight electrical though, far as I know with work. Russia and China still can't get their own Oil quickly enough, though so theres definitely a market for them, there. But with Russia and the US snuggling up, Nuclear energy is expected to explode with the Russian Plutonium Salt reactor, along with any Titanium mining going on in Vodkaville as it's expected to be the next thing since Lithium Ion batteries.

>> No.2015704

>>2015386
So what you're saying is OPEC is more or less fucked in both the short and long term.

>> No.2015983

>>2015704
>So what you're saying is OPEC is more or less fucked

Not totally fucked, they still have significant market control but its getting much weaker.

>>2015128
OPEC did intentionally "leave the tap on" when supply increased and prices fell through the floor to play a game of chicken with the US shale market. They underestimated the resilience of the US oil industry and tech. Companies juster buttoned down their costs and found more ways to be efficient. Lots of jobs lost but not killed off by a long shot. It actually gave larger operators an opportunity to buy smaller ones and consolidate. So in my opinion the Saudis and OPEC have actually strengthened the US market while cutting their main source of revenue in half. Possibly for a decade.

>> No.2016010

>>2015704
It has the potential to be, more or less, in my opinion.

Green energy is expensive, Nuclear far more so, so its not exactly an energy choice for growing countries, even if they had the position, power and dick inches in NATO to get the approval, as far as growing countries are concerned.

For the technological world powers, the better parts of Germany, Sweden, Denmark, Japan, parts of Chinkity China the Chinese Chicken, the Military sector of Russia, definitely the US if Elon Musk doesn't wake up having committed suicide by three gunshots to the back of the head, and thus can have a say in it, before this shitfest is over, and maybe Canuckistan...

Hard to really say. A lot of movers and swingers that are on the level of Musk, but on a business side, who don't associate much with Coal, Oil and Gas leaders, the Kock suckers, the Rockefuckers, though they've lost some of the swing honestly since Golem kicked the bucket, and some of the other shit heads, they are using Musk to basically launder money into the industry for Nuclear, but they're waiting for something that is a more sustainable model.

Plutonium Salt reactors are the sort of chinese knockoff grail that is Nuclear Fusion, but good luck finding out who the fuck is fronting that bill.

So they pretty much lost a lot of their influence.

Like >>2015983 said, they still have a good market share, but that'll last as long as the EU sticks around, which will be about 10 - 15 years, give or take, the way things are going. And once that happens, there will definitely be an Energy arms race, but not to going back to oil.

But OPEC does have a market in potential growing markets like Africa and South/Latin America.

Places with a MASSIVE abundance of untapped rare earth, but don't have the golden tickets needed to start refining Uranium, nor even consider it.

China and Russia will continue buying though, can't tell for how long.

>> No.2016736

>>2015386
Mexico doesn't have massive reserves, Venezuela however does
The US has more proven oil reserves in shale than Mexico does in it's total reserves

>> No.2017874

>>2016736
They have massive untapped reserves.

http://www.businessinsider.com/mexico-has-vast-untapped-oil-reserves-2014-6

>> No.2017935

>>2014762
>>2015105
What is the correlation between "low commodities prices" and shipping companies shareprice?