/biz/ - Business & Finance

Based lolbert

reminder that anarcho capitalism is not capitalism

>>17752938
Capitalism exploits the p-

>>17752969
or rather, it is not anarchism

>>17752938
Reminder that this board is
>/biz/ - Business & Finance

Get the fuck out of here faggot

>>17752938
Last week I would have agreed with you, OP. But, after this latest dump...I'm thinking maybe they have a point...

>>17753064
yeah this.... i was a proud capitalist all through my life, but seeing this.... maybe marx has a point? i never actually read him but i started das kapital today and.... damn..... he really makes a lot of sense.........

Reminder that many left wing people still support capitalism, just a form of capitalism in which the grossest excesses of neoliberalism are reigned in and the movement towards oligarchic neofeudalism are resisted.
Reminder that many left wing people support an economic structure and distribution of wealth similar to the 70s and are therefore in a way economic conservatives, insofar as they support worker protections only to the extent that their parents enjoyed them.
Reminder that this series of views is completely obfuscated by a fascist media that pumps out a "Left = minority trans lunatic" narrative that everyone eats up because it appeals to very basic "common sense" ideas that your average person has strong feelings about.

>>17753116
>>17753064
>terrible leftypol scripting
Yamn.

>>17753064
>>17753116

No one believes you're not a leftypol tranny, get fucked.

>>17753064
>>17753116
subtly isn't one your strengths faggot

>>17753116
thanks just sold 100k the ability to sell to the government for free, because they forced me

>>17753064
Uh-huh, oh yeah sure thing my fellow comrad- I mean capitalist

>>17753064
>>17753116
Wow get a load of this bullshit that literally reads like fan script, so fucking cringe.

>acknowledging their presence by making a thread
sage

Didn't leftypol die years ago who cares

>>17752938
uh oh, looks like someone is butthurt he has to actually get a job now and stop being a leech whatching squigly lines all day

>>17753018
It is the purest form of anarchy for better or worse
Literally every other thing that calls itself "anarchy" imposes some form of almost religious idealism and framework of society
Whereas AC just says "fuck you I got mine"

>>17752938
Wrong board.

>>17752981
>if you live on more than 2 dollars a day you're not poor
>capitalism is when people are poor

cope more faggot.
You're getting what you deserve for betting on capitalism now.

>>17753445
I think between starving to death with failing infrastructure and being poor while still being able to afford some level of food/shelter, i'd choose the latter. Soviet Union and China during its later years were an absolute joke. North Korea is still communist and look at the state of their population.

>>17752981
They unironically believe China is communist though, and not a capitalists wet dream where you can start a company with barely any regulation, pay no tax and do nearly whatever you want so long as you suck xi's dick.

>>17753485
>China during its later years
Huh?

>>17753534
Before it became Capitalist, you faggot...

>>17753485
Agreed, we should lift their economic sanctions to relieve the population a bit. They are already punishing themselves enough

>>17753410

>Almost religious idealism

>Muh NAP

>>17753551
Maybe because it was a country that was still transitioning from Agrarian Feudalism? Of course it had to turn to capitalism to actually create the means of production that the workers can control.

Based. /biz/ is an Anarcho-Fascist board

>>17753116
>>17753064
Marx's 10 planks for communism

> 5. Centralization of credit in the hands of the state, by means of a national bank with state capital and an exclusive monopoly.

The fed and government monetary policy are marxism.

I came here to laugh at bourgie swine like you

>>17753551
Calling China capitalist is such a fucking cope it’s hilarious.

>>17753499
I think the way it works in China is that all private property is leased from the government for something like 99 years. Since workers there theoretically control the government via participatory democracy you could argue that it is still socialism since all the private property is technically owned by the workers

>>17753695

>The fed is Marxist

You faggots will believe literally anything if it keeps alive the fantasy that you aren't a poor prole being assfucked 24/7 by capital

>>17753935
> The fed is Marxist
yes, correct.

>>17753935
Just because you suck at acquiring wealth doesn't mean that Capitalism is a horrible system. It's to the point now where the fucking federal government has to water down and spoonfeed every single fact about the markets in the schooling system, and yet people still don't get it. Communism won't fix stupidity.

>>17753935
>it's not the fed

The thing is, I win regardless of the outcome

>market rebounds, I buy dip, I retire early
>market never recovers, I don't retire early, I work a cushy job that never really feels like working
>millions of people die from coronachan, my value as a degree holding, /fit/ male skyrockets and I inherit the earth
>communism takes hold, all the trannies and spooky skeleton journalism students that have never once lifted a shovel in their lives are in for a treat as they are forced to endure manual labour as I relish in it and dab on them. They eventually get executed because they complain too much. I inherit the earth.
>society completely collapses and complete anarchy takes over. My value as a /fit/ male skyrockets as I go live in the hills fucking rocks for the rest of my life as trannies kill themselves without their estrogen and feminists learn that those police they hate are the only thing keeping this house of cards standing. I inherit the earth.

I win regardless of the outcome :)

>>17753499
China is working in the interests of communism, and corona is going to expedite their deplatforming of the west. Central planning handles pandemics like these better than any other.

>>17753695
agreed, time to support north korea and cuba, the last bastions of capitalism in this commie hellworld

>>17753695
You fucking retard those were immediate demands. The point of those demands was, in many ways, to carry out the bourgeois-democratic revolution. Do you even know what does a "manifesto" mean? Anyways, central banks predate Marx.

>>17754012
Sometimes I forget that right wingers are so fucking retarded they don't understand literally the first thing about the ideologies they claim to hate

>>17754058
>he thinks there's gonna be jobs after all of this
>he thinks there can only be capitalism or spooky cartoon anarchy
This is capitalist realism in action, folks.

>>17754117
Oh you think workers in China actually have any say in anything, you're a real sweetie.

They are coming from b*nkerchan (a chan run by furfags). It's easy to tell a /leftypol/ retard by their interest in degenerate trash like anime and trannyshit.

>>17753223
>>17753196
>>17753150
>>17753274
>>17753351
way to confess to being so sheltered that you can't even recognize your own kind jesus fucking christ

>brother i hope this finds you well but have you heard the news it is foretold that th e left cain't meem, and i'm a dip shit
>sincerely, mr cummies uwu

>>17754146
>completely glossed over the manual labour
>probably thinks he'll be 'paid to think' by the Party.

People can't disagree with me on any issue. They have to be shills!

>>17754216
Can you say that in English, please?

>>17754109
>You fucking retard those were immediate demands.
i.e., marxism.

>>17754117
Social ownership of the production and control of money is social ownership of the means of production.

>>17754026

I don't suck at acquiring wealth. I have a good job that I barely work at, I have hundreds of thousands in equity (maybe less now though lmao). All you retards are doing here is basically gambling with pennies, relatively, because you've lost all hope of ever being successful by any other means.

>>17754222
>said people rarely if ever show up before major event happens
>major event happens
>coordinated offtopic shitposting by trannies, furfags and liberal arts majors

>>17754170
China is a capitalist shithole dipshit

>>17754289
>the fed is socially owned
Not sure how you can muster the brain cells to even breathe with statements like that

>>17754183
Lol this is cop from a champagne socialist living off mommy and daddy's trust fund. Kys

>>17754178

Those things have NEVER been part of this pure Christian website

>>17754269
If you think those were the only two options presented in what I said, I think you need to learn to read English instead.

>>17754321
Well yeah. You guys constantly shit up the rest of the site and most people just don't bother to deal with you. However a big habbening means that there is a disorganized but unified thing to go on about shit.
I wouldn't trust your average discord tranny to organize shit.

>>17754334
> the fed is socially owned
It absolutely is. It exists only because it is provided a government monopoly status, it prints the government enforced legal tender, and its profits go back into the treasury.

>>17754417
Oh yeah, I forgot about your shitty vision of communism straight out of cold war propaganda. Because apparently automation somehow doesn't exist.

>>17754315
>I don't suck at acquiring wealth. I have a good job that I barely work at, I have hundreds of thousands in equity (maybe less now though lmao).
And yet here you are, advocating for the destruction of Capitalism. I've noticed how it's never the poor/working class that ever advocates for Capitalism, it's either the sheltered middle class that don't really know what the word means, or it's the upper class who think Communism sounds edgy and cool. Have fun with your bread rations and shitty built block houses.

>>17754529
How is communism supposed to work if automation takes most of the jobs.

>>17752938
>lolbertarian
I wonder why nationalism is on the rise hmmmmmmm

>>17754620
We give people based on their need? Otherwise do you think we'll just kill all of those who can't work?

>>17754425
I have honestly never seen as many offtopic /biz/ threads anywhere else as I have /v/idya or /pol/. This just goes to show that regardless of what side of the political spectrum you're on, /pol/ is the worst board.

>>17754315
How fucking stupid are you.
Do you know how far up in the 1% having hundreds of thousands makes you.
In socialism all those retards would have a right to your hundreds of thousands

>>17754445

There's a difference between being part of the government and social ownership. Social ownership would look something like every American having one non-transferrable share, and collecting a dividend. The fed isn't even owned, really. It's a branch of government in the same way the military is, and nobody owns the military.

>>17754679
I think you're confusing social subsidies like welfare with communism. The two aren't the same.

>>17754719

Cool

>>17754721
the fed is a private bank it is given authority to issue currency by a law it is not the government.

It's policy is to take peoples wealth away from them to maximise the collective output of the economy by minimizing the unemployment rate.

>>17754616
It's the people who think they will be the bureaucratic class that advocate communism.

> the workers should own the factories!
> oh, no, I don't actually want to work in a factory, I'm just saying...those that do work in factories should own it, you know? My job in the communist utopia will involve being on the board of economic advisors, or a tenured research academic.

>>17754445
>anything a government does is socialism
>working people have influence over government policy
>working people have influence over the fed's policy
mein gott

>>17754727
Welfare is shitty neoliberal cope to keep people content with their meager breadcrumbs while porks reap in all the profit, they're fundamentally not the same since there isn't a capitalist class in the first place.

>>17754721
>There's a difference between being part of the government and social ownership.
The government is owned by voters.
> Social ownership would look something like every American having one non-transferrable share
That could happen if the owners - i.e., the voters - agreed to it, but they won't.

>>17752938
Nobody wants your toothbrush. Communism is an evolution of human society. You will benefit from itm

>>17754815
>>working people have influence over government policy
>>working people have influence over the fed's policy

> Voting doesn't influence anything, but make sure you vote Bernie, and now make sure you vote Biden

>>17754818
Consider that welfare in a western country allows you to eat and live in better conditions than a king 500 years ago and you may have a point.

Again, if people are given things based on their needs without working and given a 'fair and equal' amount, nobody would work and society would break down.

>>17754914
having no ability to change the course of your life is progress.
Having your entire life dictated by a central authority is evolution.
Slavery is freedom

>>17754811
You fucking idiots can't decide whether the fed is communism (no) or a private bank (also no). You're dumbass fucking gamblers who run entirely off feels, but think you've cracked the code to riches.

>>17754914
>evolution of human society
>goes against every aspect of human nature
hmm

>>17754679
That's what commies usually do.

>>17755001
What are you talking about? Many of us will be fine after this is over. I don't think any government action or body is communist(ism). Some retards on both sides of the autistic political spectrum do for some reason. Capitalism is great but doesn't function without regulations.

>>17754888
>That could happen if the owners - i.e., the voters - agreed to it, but they won't.

If they did they would find out very quickly that they aren't actually the ones in control

>>17754183
>your own kind

it isn't even subtle, stop trying to defend your autistic friends who blew their cover you tranny faggot

>>17752938
i hate that orange faggot trump as much as the next guy but I hate you fucking commies infinitely more

>>17755001
the fed enacts the same tyranny as socialism

it steals peoples wealth

capitalism is about ownership. Ownership means someone can't take your wealth under the justification of "economic prosperity"
same way national socialists take peoples wealth under "racial prosperity" or communists take peoples wealth under "class prosperity"

>>17755001
The Fed is a private group of people granted central control over our economy through the power of government.

It is NOT a public institution, and they do not act as public servants, like all other government institutions.

It's the head of the Marxist snake.

>>17752938
"your" (((private property)))

>>17754965
>Consider that welfare in a western country allows you to eat and live in better conditions than a king 500 years ago and you may have a point.
Haha, absolutely not. People surviving on food stamps and shitty processed food is not "eating better than a king". And that's not to mention the billions of people living in starvation in third world countries under western imperialism.
>Again, if people are given things based on their needs without working and given a 'fair and equal' amount, nobody would work and society would break down.
Work under communism would be based on ability, so if there is work needed to be done and there are people capable of doing it, it will be done. However, if most of production is automated anyway then work wouldn't need be done at all.

>>17753135
wow interesting how everyone takes the low hanging fruit and nobody engages with statements that blur the lines between muh partisan soapboxes.
it's almost like this board is filled with one dimensional zoomer retards who have no concept of nuance.

>>17755189

>>17755225
"guys i dont know what the fuck im talking about!!! give me attention!!!"

>>17755262
>calling the fed tyrannical is jewish

>>17755148

Why would we try to be subtle

>>17754914
You can't make communism or socialism work because they don't exist on a vacuum.
The natural state of the human is an oligarchy. An all powerful king that got there by killing all his rivals.
Capitalism is a scam that makes those people try to collect money instead of doing the whole "army of death" shit, and without it, army of death shit it is, regardless of your intentions.
We are hard wired into the whole king shit, and it fucking sucks.

This is why you have shit like venezuela, cuba etc..
As soon they yanked the capitalism out, oligarchy came.
If you want to replace capitalism, you have to invent an even more effective scam.

>>17755259
you mean nobody falls for your fabian "we just want denmark" crap.

>>17755305
Both communism and capitalism has jewish undertones.

>>17752938
>Reminder that /leftypol/ does not belong on this board.
idk Marxism is an economic theory, and thats what this board is for. Whos to say we cant talk about co-ops and market socialism at the least.

>>17755383
there's no "falls for" dipshit 99% of people here literally can't have a discussion that doesn't strawman one side as "muh gulags" or the other side as "muh nazis". It's profoundly retarded..

>>17755387
oh you're a proponent of the The National Socialist German Workers' Party where the ability to own something was dependent on it being ok with a socialist drop out arts student with an unoriginal moustache

>>17755441
Gulags are what "we just want denmark" fabians actually want.

You can't fool anybody, commie.

>>17752938
>Protecting your personal and private property from communists is a legitimate use of force and not against the Non-Aggression Principle.

what assets bro its over

>>17755189

The fed doesn't steal wealth, it keeps markets liquid so they can function. That requires a little bit of inflation, but they aren't bursting in to steal your shit in the middle of the night, retard.

>>17755491
You're not significant enough to warrant a gulag, don't worry.

>>17755536
printing money reduces the value of the dollar. It takes wealth from people who have dollars and gives that wealth to the recipients of the printed money. And since the government makes dollars legal tender, and that taxes must be paid in dollars, you can avoid this wealth extraction.

>>17755641
> you can avoid this wealth extraction.
you can NOT* avoid this wealth extraction

>>17755491
whoa you know what i actually want and it's a retarded strawman of my actual views. thanks for your insight into my own mind.

>>17755536
they create bubbles with regulation like basel II.
your salary and savings are denominated in usd the usd loses 7%pa by design. >>17754027

Keynesian economic policy is financial repression by design. They stop you accumulating wealth to stop you from retiring

>>17752938
I don't know anymore lads. Marx said that eventually Capitalism would collapse from its own inherent contradictions right? Is that not happening right before our eyes? How can we save Capitalism at this point because otherwise it means the lefties were right all along.

>>17754924
When did I say that voting for Bernie would solve anything, dumbass? They're never giving him the nomination anyway

>>17755683
>whoa you know what i actually want
that's correct, I do.
The fact that somebody would lie about their position to make it more appealing to naive people is not unbelievable.

>>17753116
WTF I HATE CAPITALISM NOW

im a marx missile now

>>17755763
>They're never giving him the nomination anyway
He didn't get the votes.

>>17752938

>>17755641

>Money is wealth

Nice 1. It's a medium of exchange. The reason inflation is necessary is to make retards like you actually buy shit with it, which is what actually creates wealth.

>>17755863
> Money is wealth
Yes, that's correct.

>>17754721
>nobody owns the military

>>17755863
>you can't accumulate wealth you have to buy things

>which is what actually creates wealth.
forcing people to lose wealth creates wealth. The absolute state

antithetical to capitalism

>>17753064
Wait till the announced final crisis of the Capital. You'll change your mind overnight. Unfortunately, it's not for tommorow.

>>17755741
No, he didn't say Marx would automatically collapse. He did say that capital accumulation is inherently contradictory however and that when these contradictions are frustrated they explode, resulting in crises, however. Marx thought that the only way out of capitalism is through a conscious and coordinated revolution by the wage workers.

>>17755907
What is the singular purpose of money

>>17755966
fuck, I meant capitalism, not Marx

>>17755741
You cannot save it. TRPF is inevitable.

>>17755960

You know Andrew Jackson was a lead poisoned retard right

>>17755971
to exchange for (other) goods and services.
If somebody takes money from you they have taken your ability to acquire (other) goods and services. At the very least, you would say that taking money is taking away your future wealth - thus theft - but the reality is that money is a commodity and thus a good in and of itself, and is thus part of wealth.

>>17753463
imagine being stupid enough to think any form of economic system other than capitalism would suffice. Truly stupid.

>>17756068
nice argument you socialist with hundreds of thousands of dollars

OP lives in a dream world. But dreams are pretty fucking lonely. Reality, at the very least has 7 billion others who reside there.
Wake the fuck up OP.
Stop living in a dream world.

>>17756028
It is unlikely the rate of profit will hit absolute zero. In order for that to happen, you'd need a rate of surplus value of 0%.

>>17752938
Why the fuck is this thread still up?
Are the jannies asleep, too, on top of being incompetent to begin with?

>>17755821
Yeah, entire media and political class solidified against him as expected. Plus voter suppression and retarded boomers. The ruling class always wins at their own game, that's no surprise.

Reminder that we should eat the rich and guillotine them

>>17756091

Love how me being smarter and more successful than you is somehow an argument against my position, in your mind.

>>17752938
>MUH PROPERTY
>THINKING FUTURES WERE EVER REAL

LOL STONKS GO UP

>>17756170
you don't know my net worth.
it's hypocritical, you are your own oppressor

>>17756143
Reminder that everybody on /biz/ hates your fucking guts

You aren't welcome here and your posting sticks out like a sore thumb.

>>17755960
What creates wealth is labor. Or 'slavery', as you might call it. Because you're a bludger who wants what someone else worked for. We need to bring back the death penalty for speculators.

>>17756170
>considers having capital as being smarter
>is socialist
wtf are you taking the piss at this point

>>17756122
True, is could theoretically indefinitely tend toward 0 without ever reaching it. However, the fatal combo is the tendency of the rate of profit to fall, combined with market saturation. Game over.

>>17756204
Communism isn't an ideology; it's a system. Marxism is an ideology. We do not deny Marxist revolutions have happened.

>>17756218
Labor is not slavery, having wealth stolen from you to maximise your labor is slavery

>>17756170
>argument
>lol he be the retard xD
There was no argument to begin with

>>17753499
>not being able to own property and have more than 2 children is capitalism

>>17756250
>Communism isn't an ideology; it's a system. Marxism is an ideology.
didnt ask

fuck off and die

>>17755763
You were singing a different song during the Iowa primary, leftyshit tranny.

>>17756204

>Pls go away ur being mean waah

Why are rightoids so fragile

>>17756267
>Labor isn't slavery
>This is what communists actually believe

>>17756278
bot

>>17752938

>>17755306
Because you've spent the last 5 years utterly embarrassing yourselves and now the pendulum is swing so hard to the right that we've started electing literal fascists into power?

>>17756218
The existence of the secondary market makes the primary market more profitable, meaning more capital available to producers. No "speculative" market would lower capital available to companies selling their stock.

>>17756204
I'm not a communist I'm just going to kill you (if you're hoarding resources) if I ever get the chance haha
This board is anti kikery, you're the one in the wrong place. Most here are trying to make it to escape the system and if that fails then there's really nothing stopping me from coming at you
Also most of these communists in 2020 are privileged babies that go too

>>17756290
What happened to the "marketplace of ideas"

>>17756307
If someone wants to exchange labor (work) for something else that is not slavery
In socialism you are forced to work by the state and can never change that because you cannot own anything

>>17756127
As if Bernie was ever a threat to his fellow (((((elites))))). Will you sunset yourself when he comes out to endorse Biden, or will you start saying "hey, maybe this Joe guy is the future!" like you did with Hilldawg?

>>17756307
Unpaid labor is slavery.

>>17756290
why do you have to invade places where you arent wanted? this is a board for business and finance

you're literally pushing people who didn't bother you towards helicopter memes. hope it's worth spamming "porky" and "bootlicker" over and over again to people who are already unreceptive to your ideas

come to based korea nigger. Let's see how tough you really are

>>17756348
>I'm not a communist I'm just going to kill you (if you're hoarding resources) if I ever get the chance haha
Come and take it you fucking communist. I'm armed to the teeth and will defend what's mine.

>>17756392
No, it isn't, you fucking coomoid; it's surplus value extraction/exploited wage labor.

>>17756372
All political economy is a scam.

oh man imagine an economic system that just does this every 10 years and you cant do piss about it

>>17756372
>like you did with Hilldawg?
based retard. no leftists supported killary

>>17756365
I think we can all say that we are for political violence

>>17756392
I was being a little metaphorical.

>>17752938

lol cry harder, rightoid

Literally everybody sees through the stale-ass shock memes you people post. You're cowards, and your "kill all commies" shit is just a front for you being a bunch of weak-shit soft-ass incels who have nothing going for them as people

>>17756402
Why do you assume it's an invasion. Maybe people are starting to embrace leftism. I for one welcome them because it broadens the discourse.

>>17756329

The retarded boomers responsible are currently going out of their way to expose themselves to coronavirus. I'm not worried, the demographic shift has already happened and the reaction is a bunch of old people trying to fight the incoming tide

>>17756372

lmfao imagine thinking that centrist libs and leftists are the same thing

For people who pride yourselves on being "counter-culture," you people deepthroat the dick of the basic framing provided by the MSM daily

>>17756402
>stop bullying me or i'll post helicopter memes
lmao sorry but the whole of 4chan is laughing at you today, why wouldn't they? get a sense of humor. Oh and get an actual productive job too you fucking degenerate leech.

>>17756582
>lmfao imagine thinking that centrist libs and leftists are the same thing
You will vote Biden and you will like it.

>>17756625

lol no

>>17756496
There are literally posts on /leftypol/ linking to /biz/ and encouraging invasion and subversion and propaganda spreading on this board. You disingenuous fuck

https://bunkerchan dot xyz/leftypol/res/8552.html

i was pretty moderate before but now that you guys are smugly spamming in /biz/, i honestly don't give a fuck if the military guns you Marxist-Leninist retards down in the street. I would laugh and support them.

I hope the DNC calls in the riot police on you losers in July. That would be pretty cool to see your heads busted and bleeding.

>>17756439
i'm coming for your toothbrush be careful

>>17756625
Kek that kike can't even speak a sentence why would any leftist vote for him.

>>17756625
lol no [2]

>>17756639

>>17756402

I am completely unconcerned with a couple of hundred socially isolated idiots on a cryptocurrency scamming board becoming even more explicitly fascist than they already were

>>17756639
Keep dreaming nigger. What are you gonna do? Cry to the police? HAHAHAHAHHA What a dumb faggot, but that's expected from a parasite who has never worked a day in his life. Honestly, kill yourself, you dumb retarded waste of oxygen

>>17756582
That's because you can't make the difference between twitter LGBT's and readers of Karl fucking Marx. It's your problem.

>>17756589
It's not that I'll post helicopter memes. I'll just laugh when fascists kill you. Have fun!

>>17756639

>thinking we're all leninists

lmao keep deepthroating the strawmen in your head, retard

>>17753135

Do you happen to be european?

I ask this because it's usually burgers that really have "extreme" opinions and have no concept at all of more nuanced perspectives.
Also, I completely agree with you, we're clearly heading towards a neo feudalism and we must stop this shit and go back to an "healthier" capitalist equilibrium.

>>17756703
Hitler was a keynesian

>>17756639
>still thinks most lefties are into electoral politics
now how can I argue with you when you're this brainwashed?

>>17756712

>retard propping up a false dichotomy because of a shallow resentment based on lifestyle aesthetics

lmfao you said fuck

>>17756710
>>17756733
You're all unironic tankies who salivate at muh guillotines. Very few of you are actual social democrats or whatever you want to call it.

I legitimately don't care if fascists kill tankies. Good riddance.

>>17756714
> I'll just laugh when fascists kill you.
idk if you're gonna have much luck with that, bro

>>17756714
And I'll laugh when you lose money so what's the difference you fucking crybaby? You can stop acting hard on the internet now, the mask has already slipped.

>>17756781

I'm an anarchist you blithering retard, lmfao