/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>17407353
I never understood the people who shit on TA. How do you even trade without it?

>>17407429
You hold long term and dont listen to your meme lines because you interpret them based on what you want. Stop lying to yourself.Only works on stocks.

>>17407429
Confirmation bias. Most people who hate on TA used it at one point and try to make their chart point in the direction they want. When it fails they think it's because of the TA.

>>17407353
Now count the subwaves of 1 on your picture. There are clearly 3 waves. How it can be an impulse?

>>17407353
If TA worked wouldn't people who "understand" it become millionaires almost instantly?

elliot wave is a fucking meme. it's more of an art than an actual trading style.

please, keep shorting and longing like the gambling retard that you are. arthur needs a new lambo

What does TA stand for?

>>17407501
TA isn't everything.
There's risk management (for minimizing damage when you're wrong), and trading psychology (for minimizing fear).

>>17407530
Technical Analysis

>>17407454
Based on my chart

>Buy on Dec 16 during bullish RSI divergence
>Place a stop loss calculated by ATR
>Hold based on Elliot Waves
>Sell at Wave 5 which ended at previous top
>Place a short stop loss calculated by ATR
>30% Profit
>Wait for the A-B wave dip

>>17407541
Hidden bullish divergence from 3 to 4 was a great setup too.

>>17407353
>"trades" unregulated assets that are majority scam projects ran by whale manipulators 24/7
>calls people who don't want to do this "low IQ"

>>17407561
- Fuck (((regulators))).
- Fiat is way more of a scam than Bitcoin.

>>17407553
Yep, safe to accumulate more or good entry if you were late.

>>17407353
TA has been statistically proven to be ineffective. Buying and holding outperforms TA every single time.

Tachyon's costumized modules for SDK, Prioritize per data transmission type

I've always had an issue with Elliot wave in terms of knowing where the wave "begins" But your example is pretty solid in describing that it begins at the confirmation of the divergence in the RSI

>>17407516
I really only use elliot wave when it's obvious like here. I also use it to see how late I am to a rally.

>>17407615
>Buying and holding
I stopped believing in "HODL" during Bitcoin's bear market of 2018 and learned how to trade. I wish I had done it years ago, but I'm glad I took the time to learn.

Is there something like this for TA?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_prizes_for_evidence_of_the_paranormal

>>17407577
Fiat is a scam but trading with it isn't.
Crypto isn't a scam but trading with it is.

Crypto has no liquidity and almost all volume is fake. Therefore TA is entirely unreliable.

>>17407641
This. Also it's better to watch BTC pairs of altcoins rather than the USD/USDT pairs. Wish I had learned that early too.

>>17407641
You can believe whatever you want too. People who buy and hold have higher statistical returns on average compared to those who trade. But i’m sure you are the little special exception like all the others.

You can trade based ONLY on TA.
Also TA works, but most of the time you have to move a little your lines accordingly, again and again and again.

>>17407561
If you want to avoid scams stay away 99% of altcoins.

>>17407353
I don't know, but I'm glad many don't believe in it. The more retail TA participating out there, the more mind game fuckery the market imposes on us.

>>17407681
What about after 2017?

>>17407641
how'd you learn? i want to as well

>>17407705
This is the guy I learned most of it from. I highly recommend this video to everyone on /biz/

https://youtu.be/-c0kSklJ7e4

>>17407727
okay anon ill check it out thanks, you pulling in a living wage from trading shitcoins now?

>>17407353
this is some of the only good ta I've seen on this board

>>17407702
What about it? This is a statstical average for all asset classes, not just Bitcoin.

>>17407757
I generally stay away from shitcoins, honestly I'm actually considering pulling out of crypto entirely. Both BTC and USDT dominance are going down and Altcoins aren't going up. This occurring while Coronavirus is spreading is telling me smart money is pulling out of crypto.

>>17407353
Ok. So the 9750ish is a new low then?

>>17407780
Because pretty much every hodler I know loses money. They buy at seemingly random times and never sell, even while the price is high. I know some people who bought before the ATH and never sold until sometime during the drop to $3k.

>>17407812
You are really stupid. Smart money wouldn’t be pulling their assets out of an uncorrelated, decoupled, hedge asset during a time of crisis.

>>17407888
>cites anecdotal evidence as proof
Ok brainiac, go ahead and day trade, use some leverage too. More gainz!

If you want to get even more anecdotal I’ll bet you my returns outsize yours by 100x.

>>17407812
>Altcoins aren't going up
where have you been the past two months

>>17407894
When both the largest coins by volume are losing dominance and all the other alternatives aren't increasing, where does that tell you the money is going? Binance is the most popular crypto trading platform which is located at ground zero of the virus, yeah I think I may switch to gold for now.

>>17407915
I don't view the USD prices or pairs of altcoins. BTC pairs have remained lackluster for awhile now. Altcoin USD price increases are more often than not just altcoins piggy backing off of BTC going up.

>>17407947
You do realize that market dominance is a closed system of all cryptocurrencies right? If the biggest are losing dominance, the smaller ones are gaining dominance, it always equals 100% LOL

As you see Bitcoin has lost a bit of dominance, and alt coins have gained a bit of dominance. You really don’t know what you are talking about.

>>17407705
It was a really roundabout journey for me which started here when someone introduced me to RSI.
Then I learned how to look for divergence between RSI and price, and that remains my main weapon after all these years.
It's a good way to find reversals.
https://www.babypips.com/learn/forex/divergence-cheat-sheet

Then I learned about moving averages, and how they provide dynamic support and resistance. There's a Singaporean guy on YouTube named Rayner Teo who explains how to use moving averages really well, so I recommend looking him up. He's particularly good at riding trends, which I'm still kinda bad at. I like looking for reversals, but I have this habit of pussying out too quickly and taking my profits early.

I've been trying to improve on this by making use of the following tools:
https://www.tradingview.com/script/3rxOtFe0-CM-Guppy-EMA/
https://www.tradingview.com/script/9wda3yUw-Open-Close-Cross-Strategy-NoRepaint-Version-by-JustUncleL/
https://medium.com/@ColdBloodShill/renko-trading-strategies-building-on-the-foundations-6250f0693bce

For trading psychology, there's a guy named Mark Douglas who passed away some years ago, but he's put out the most famous material on this topic. It's fascinating how fear distorts your judgement, and you can really glean life lessons from this that you can use outside of trading. The psychological side of trading is a hidden gem. It can teach you so much about yourself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgaTlTfQnZI

>>17407985
This is how I view dominance. As you can see the BTC dominance keeps going lower and lower even despite the price going up. Volume is also increasing as it goes down.

>>17407705
>>17407995
One thing that Rayner mentions in his videos frequently is the concept of "area of value". These are places on the chart where action is likely to occur, and its usually near a support or resistance.

They can come in many forms:
- Horizontal support & resistance
- Trendline support & resistance
- Moving averages (especially the popular ones on large timeframes)

When you open or close a position, you want to do it in these areas of value, because that increases your chances of success. Also, it lets you minimize your risk so that if you're wrong, you don't lose that much.

The defensive side of trading is really important too. It's not just about making money, but also not losing money either. You want to make sure that your losses are small so that you survive. The art of risk management is super important.

>>17407985
And here's the USDT dominance. Also going down and has closed below some key moving averages. If it doesn't bounce here I'll strongly consider leaving crypto for metals until I see another good buy opportunity for BTC.

>>17408058
That is literally JUST bitcoin dominance. Are you trolling? Bitcoin price going up increases altcoin prices, and if they make an meager gain against bitcoin price, their dominance goes up against bitcoin. You are seriously clueless. I’d love to see your portfolio gains/losses.

>>17408091
USDT dominance going down means people ARE BUYING CRYPTO with USDT. You legitimately must be trolling.

>>17407985
>>17408058
>>17408091
>>17408114
>>17408125
Thread should be retitiled “are TA fags too low IQ to understand markets”

>>17407681
HODL is only good for bull markets. In a bear market, HODL is suicide, and it's irresponsible to be preaching that strategy that refuses to sell.

>>17408125
>>17408114
Altcoin USD value going up with BTC/USD going up is almost always just altcoins going up because they are worth a certain amount of BTC each. Altcoin/BTC pairs aren't really going up which means money from BTC isn't going there. This is just my observation, I know most of you guys trade Altcoin/USDT pairs so you won't really understand from my point of view. Fewer people trade that way than you might think.

>>17408210
Listen dude, if Altcoins are gaining market dominance (they are slightly) they are going up AGAINST BTC. Meaning they are gaining sats. You are seriously lacking a fundamental understand of how market dominance is calculated.

>>17408244
Look so far you've told me TA doesn't work (it does) and hodlers make more money (not after 2017) and now we're debating dominance. Every one of your replies to me is negative for the sake of being negative. I know from experience that when USDT dominance goes down, BTC dominance goes up. That is no longer the case which has me concerned. Also the whole Binance in China with Coronavirus just pushes me further away. I haven't left crypto yet, I'm just pointing out these things out of concern.

>>17408345
What I’ve told you is TA has been shown not to provide any statistical edge in trading on average. Also, holders statistically on average have greater returns than traders. These are objective facts. I’m not being negative for the sake of being negative, you don’t understand what market dominance is. Bitcoin dominance has gone UP vs USDT dominance, however Bitcoin dominance has gone down vs alt coin dominance. This means people are BUYING crypto, predominately altcoins. You can speculate all you’d like i’m just listing facts, don’t like hearing them? That is on you and your own ignorance.

>>17407353
>Are most people too low IQ for TA?
>Why do the majority of crypto traders laugh at the idea of using TA?
What a low IQ statement, any market maker can come along & move the market, no TA needed. It could even be argued that markets only move cause market makers want them to move in a direction.

>>17408392
Then I'm just gonna assume it's because 90% of traders lose money which is true. I'm usually around decent traders and people who know real TA like me and I forget the majority lose money because of bad TA. I refuse to believe that swing traders with decent TA earn less on average than hodlers.

>>17407353
Maybe I should be learning TA, but crypto has some many more factors that disrupt the flow of things like how BTC heavily influences the entire market. I normally just short when something has pumped really high, and long when there's something I think is bullish

>>17408424
How has the "muh manipulation" meme not died out yet.

>>17408424
>market maker
Even whales have to use TA to find good spots to do their manipulation. They can't just do their moves from anywhere. They risk losing money too. They have to be smart about where they go stop hunting.

>>17407615
midwit

>>17408463
>BTC heavily influences the entire market
This is why I trade mostly BTCUSD and sometimes ETHUSD. I kinda wish I got into LINKUSD though.

>>17408463
TA is nice, but don't forget risk management and psychology.

https://twitter.com/TradingComposur <-- this guy is good for the latter.

>>17408463
I highly recommend you practice TA just on BTC/USD. Once you get better and more confident then try altcoins. Bitcoin influences every altcoin because all altcoins are worth some BTC. This is why you should stick to BTC/USD first.

Hello TA sirs
10k when?

>>17407353
it's a tool to use in combination with fundamental A. and stop losses

>>17407553
>Hidden bullish divergence from 3 to 4 was a great setup too
at 3 and 4 it was a bearish divergence
In that case following TA based on divergences would have lead you to losses

>>17408635
Maybe during the B wave, wave 5 just ended. Looking at my weekly chart assuming wave B goes up to 10k it'll be temporary.

>>17408707
damn that sucks
should i just tether up?

>>17407888
>I know some people who bought before the ATH and never sold until sometime during the drop to $3k
there is not a ''rule'' to follow... (sell or hodl)
you simply sell when the asset you are holding has exausted his full potencial
Or you sell when you see an incredible hype
Swinging for some breadcumbs for example is a stupid thing

>>17408707
at 3 and 4 it was a bearish divergence ?

>>17408717
Yeah going short for now seems like the best choice. Just be sure to have a stop loss.

>>17408717
op is a moron fyi

>>17408751
Hidden bullish divergence. I use green arrows for bullish and red for bearish.

>>17408698
Do you not know what HIDDEN bullish divergence is? Stop fucking typing if you don't know.

Have any of you TA traders ever done historical back testing of your ideas using an out of sample dataset?

>>17408775
but what is the difference between regular divergences and hidden divergences?

>>17407669
why trade x/btc over x/usd?

how the fuck do u find ur edge in TA?