/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>16201735
Transfer money online without a centralized third party middleman.

>>16201739
you can transfer money without bitcoin. the method is irrelevant if the result is the same

>>16201760
The result isn't the same though.

>>16201772
you are right, paypal transfers money instantly, bitcoin takes a few hours

>>16201760
The result is not the same.
Fees are higher if you use a centralized third party middleman, services like PayPal can seize your money if you transfer money in ways that they don't like (including for reasons that are still legal), and if you are trying to sell a good or service, you can be chargebacked by the buyer, and almost always you will lose out in disputes.

Buy acid on the internet

>>16201778
BTC takes 5 - 10 minutes though?

>>16201788
Any trusted .onion sites for that?

>>16201784
>fees are higher
bitcoin fees are extremely high. If you use a business account your fees are significantly lower than bitcoin
>paypal can seize your money
no they can't, they can freeze them temporarily if you do something against their rules
>you can be chargebacked by the buyer
and thats why everyone is using paypal, because consumers are protected. With bitcoin the merchant can scam you and there is nothing you can do about it
>>16201810
you are confusing btc with bsv

>>16201827
>bitcoin fees are extremely high.
They aren't, that's pre-Segwit talk. In the future fees and transaction times will probably increase, but BCH and BSV are options if Blockstream doesn't solve the issue adequately.
>no they can't, they can freeze them temporarily
That's wrong, in most cases if they freeze your money you're never getting it back.
>if you do something against their rules
You're arguing for Bitcoin.
>and thats why everyone is using paypal, because consumers are protected. With bitcoin the merchant can scam you and there is nothing you can do about it
You can do decentralized escrow with Bitcoin which solves this issue.

>>16201824
Nope mister fbi, do your own research but a friend once told me that there is one called gammagoblin or something like that

>>16201824
Empire, you can find constantly updated non-phishing links here: darkfailllnkf4vf.onion (clearnet: dark.fail).

>>16201882
this is about bitcoin not other crypto. other crypto can have 0 fees
>if they freeze your money you're never getting it back.
thats wrong, if you never got your money back you most likely did something illegal
>You're arguing for Bitcoin.
the average person isn't a criminal and doesn't give a fuck about those rules
>You can do decentralized escrow with Bitcoin
so are you saying... you need some kind of trusted middleman to handle the transactions between two parties? kinda like.. paypal?

>>16201778
>few hours
imagine still using segwit coin

>>16201916
Decentralized escrow would specifically be the absence of a trusted middleman, brainlet

>>16201735
shitpost online instead of be being a wagie

Get USD with an Asian currency in a country with currency controls and not pay ridiculous fees for the bank wire.

Retain the value of my currency/savings
>inb4 bobo shit
Zoom out.

>>16201943
>escrow
>without middle man
escrow is by definition a middleman dumbass

>>16201916
>other crypto can have 0 fees
They aren't secure.
>thats wrong, if you never got your money back you most likely did something illegal
Nope, it just means you violated their ToS, which disallows many legal transfers, including buying crypto.
>the average person isn't a criminal and doesn't give a fuck about those rules
Until it affects them, go look up "PayPal stole my money" on PayPal community, plenty of normalfags losing their money without breaking the law and saying they never got it back/got no reply.
>so are you saying... you need some kind of trusted middleman to handle the transactions between two parties? kinda like.. paypal?
No, I said decentralized escrow, there is no third-party.
Buyer locks money into an address with the seller. If the transaction goes smoothly, then both buyer and seller sign the transaction to forward the money to the seller, if not the Bitcoin stays forever locked and the seller gets nothing. In this case there is no economic incentive for the seller to attempt to scam the buyer.

imagine being such a weak-willed sissy faggot you move the goalposts to protect your cognitive dissonance after your dumbass question got obliterated
on an anonymous board where nobody even knows your name
zoomers were a mistake

>>16201735

Have a savings account that only I can access. That's the point of BTC, not just any state authorized entity can stick their hand into your money.

>>16201735
Hide your money in your brain, even if you get arrested, all your assets seized, bank accounts frozen, any online accounts like PayPal closed/suspended, any gold you had stashed at home confiscated, etc.

You could sneak off to a different country, probably a 3rd world country where they'll never find you, and bring your riches with you in your brain and live like a king.

All you need to do is memorize 12 words and you will have a portable numbered Swiss bank account they can never touch.

This kind of thing has never been accessible to normies before Bitcoin. You used to need to have like shell companies in some tax haven, dummy corporations, need millions of dollars, and you could still get busted like everyone caught in the Panama papers.

Now little Johnny with his $25 lunch money can suddenly be in a portable Swiss account, protected from any government in the world, it's insane really.

>>16201980
>They aren't secure.
and bitcoin isn't fast or efficient
>which disallows many legal transfers, including buying crypto.
now you are just outright lying. Paypal doesn't disallow buying crypto
>Until it affects them
so are you saying paypal doesn't offer a good service? so use one of the dozens alternatives to paypal like skrill, wepay, googlepay, amazonpay, venmo. If paypal was really that bad everyone would just use the other companies
>No, I said decentralized escrow, there is no third-party.
I don't think you understand what an escrow is. An escrow is a third party that handles the transaction between 2 parties. What if the buyer signs and the merchant doesn't ship his product? There is no incentive for the buyer to sign first

>>16202028
except you first have to withdraw that money first to use them, and you get caught when you do
or maybe you can just use bitcoin directly? too bad all your transactions are public and traceable

>>16202046
>and bitcoin isn't fast or efficient
An average of 10 minutes is fast and efficient, and that wait is only required if you want do 1-conf, with 0-conf it's practically instant.
>Paypal doesn't disallow buying crypto
It's against the ToS, people have had their accounts locked before for attempting it, look it up.
> so use one of the dozens alternatives to paypal like skrill, wepay, googlepay, amazonpay, venmo. If paypal was really that bad everyone would just use the other companies
All of the ones you listed as far as I know disallow some sorts of non-illegal transactions, and some are less consumer-friendly than using decentralized escrows.
>I don't think you understand what an escrow is. An escrow is a third party that handles the transaction between 2 parties.
The escrow agent is the mechanism of locking the Bitcoins before an agreement/disagreement is reached.
Whatever you want to call it, it provides no economic incentives to scam people.
>What if the buyer signs and the merchant doesn't ship his product? There is no incentive for the buyer to sign first
The buyer doesn't sign until he receives his product. There is no economic incentive for the buyer not to sign after he receives it since his Bitcoin is locked, either it goes to the seller or it's lost forever.

>>16202046
Escrow can be represented as a smart contract and automate the process, but I wouldn’t expect you to understand that because you can’t seem to grasp the improvement bitcoin makes over the existing financial system

>>16202067
There are plenty of no-kyc ways to cash out.
I've cashed in and cashed out tens of thousands of dollars without ever giving ID, and I'm in a third world shithole country.
Even though LBC had closed their doors to that, many other ways exist.

Also you seem to have never heard of coinjoin before.

>>16202102
>and im in a third world shit country
Maybe thats the reason it worked without kyc you fucking nigger

>>16202102
Please tell me your ways daddy

>>16202084
>It's against the ToS
no its not, you are just lying. It would only be against the ToS if you are selling bitcoin without being a registered exchange, which is against the actual law not paypal rules
>The escrow agent is the mechanism of locking the Bitcoins before an agreement/disagreement is reached.
exactly, and how will the escrow mechanism know if the agreement is reached? unless that escrow mechanism is also a superintelligent AI then the escrow will be a middleman
>>16202100
and what improvement bitcoin makes over the existing financial system? I bet you are too dumb to even answer and will just find an excuse to avoid it
>>16202102
>There are plenty of no-kyc ways to cash out.
yes and they all involve selling to random pajeets in the street
>and I'm in a third world shithole country.
yep, makes sense.

>>16202046
>Paypal doesn't disallow buying crypto
It does, retard

>>16202136
proof moron?

>>16202143
dyr

Paypal banned everything crypto-related

>>16202151
thanks for admitting you are a retard with no proof and you are just spewing bullshit

>>16202126
>It would only be against the ToS if you are selling bitcoin without being a registered exchange,
It's not in most Western parts of the world.
>how will the escrow mechanism know if the agreement is reached?
The buyer and seller do it themselves by either signing or not signing, or instead they can automate the whole thing with oracles (buy LINK) and smart contracts.
In the case of them signing it themselves, there is no economic incentive for:
a) the seller to begin the transaction with the buyer if he is just there to scam, he won't end up receiving the money if he doesn't give the buyer the product.
b) the buyer not to give the money to the seller after he receives the product, he has spent his money anyway so he might as well give it to the seller rather than having it locked forever.

Lose money

>>16202155
It's in your interests to DYR since you're the ignorant one, I'm not gonna prove anything.

Crypto banned everything crypto-related, you cannot pay for bitcoin or crypto with PayPal or receive money from crypto with PayPal.

>>16202126
>trusted third parties are security holes
>trusted third parties are security holes
>trusted third parties are security holes

Just run that through the ol noggin until you get it

>>16202157
>It's not in most Western parts of the world.
it is though, and it will be in all parts soon enough
>The buyer and seller do it themselves
thats the whole point of escrow, that the buyer and seller can't do it themselves, if they could do it themselves they wouldn't need an escrow
>>16202168
you are either too dumb or just lying. don't reply again unless you have proof moron
>>16202174
>chink miners are trustworthy
>chink miners are trustworthy
>chink miners are trustworthy
try repeating that in whatever brain cells you have left

>>16202193
Okay, keep deluding yourself that PayPal allows crypto-related transactions, pompous fucktard

>>16202210
Coinbase literally accepts paypal you 30 IQ brainless moron

>>16202216
It's for cashing out only, not buying

>>16202193
>it is though, and it will be in all parts soon enough
Wrong
>thats the whole point of escrow, that the buyer and seller can't do it themselves, if they could do it themselves they wouldn't need an escrow
Right, in normal cases the buyer might lose out, but if they use decentralized escrow like I described, then the locking mechanism handles it for them through incentives.

>>16202233
you can buy too dumbass, and not only from coinbase from multiple other places

why you keep spewing bullshit instead of just posting us proof directly from paypal?

>>16202235
>wrong
you must too dumb and naive to think countries will not eventually regulate everything crypto related to the same level of fiat regulations
>then the locking mechanism handles it for them through incentives
you described the same system paypal uses. paypal is locking your money too until the transaction and product delivery is finished

>>16201914
Don’t help glowniggers, Anon.

>>16202271
You can't buy crypto with PayPal, period. Neither on Coinbase nor elsewhere. PayPal is refundable, crypto is not.

>>16202283
>6 replies
>still 0 proof of claims
ok retard keep repeating your bullshit

>>16202289
>15 posts by this ID
>keeps on shit talking instead of doing his research

>>16202299
you got BTFO kid. You don't have any proof because it doesn't exist. Keep embarassing yourself though

>>16202271
>you must too dumb and naive to think countries will not eventually regulate everything crypto related to the same level of fiat regulations
That doesn't mean they will make it illegal to buy.
Some countries like mine already have regulation and yet it's still not illegal to do so.
Prove that it's going to happen.
>you described the same system paypal uses. paypal is locking your money too until the transaction and product delivery is finished
Okay, so you have no clue how PayPal works.
If I'm a seller, and someone pays money for good or service to me, then I give him the product as described, he is still free to chargeback his money for up to 60 days, if I dispute the chargeback, in almost all cases they will win and keep their money.
Decentralized escrow is better than this model.

>>16202315
Oh, you're dumb and can't DYR, I see. I already explained everything, see >>16202136

>>16202320
I never said its going to be illegal, I said its going to be regulated at the same level as other fiat, which means you have to have a licence to be an exchange
>in almost all cases they will win and keep their money
so why don't you do it? you can become a millionaire. Just buy expensive things for free everyday and do a chargeback. It must be so easy to do it right?

>>16202334
so you admit you are a retard with no proof? don't reply again unless you post proof retard, I have no time for brainless morons like you that spew bullshit and offer 0 proof

>>16202345
The burden of proof lies on you. Show at least one exchange that accepts PayPal (for buying). Oh wait, there's NONE.

>>16201760

Go ahead and transfer money to your friend who lived in north korea or iran. We’ll wait.

>>16202337
>I said its going to be regulated at the same level as other fiat,
It won't illegal to buy crypto, along many other things that PayPal regulates for without legal purposes.
>Just buy expensive things for free everyday and do a chargeback.
People actually do this if you aren't aware, doing it too often can get your account locked but you can just make a new one. Eventually if you do it too often you can get into legal issues but almost everyone who fraudulently chargebacks never gets caught though.
How is this model equal to or better than decentralized escrow? There is an economic incentive for the buyer to scam the seller, with decentralized escrow there is no economic incentive to scam at all.

>>16202366
>at least one
VirWox
Paxful
Cancoin
Wirex
Cryptonit
eToro

here are 6 dumbass. Now post me proof that they aren't

>>16202374
fortunately I am not a terrorist so I wouldn't care about that

>>16202383
so why don't you do it buddy? you hate money? you can get thousands worth of computers and electronics for free. I mean its fulproof, it always works and you never get caught. Why dont you do it?

>>16201920

If you want fast transactions use dollars retard.

>>16202374
>friend
>in North Korea/Iran
KEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEK great argument

>>16202387
You googled some defunct services from pajeet spam websites. None of them accept PayPal as of now or are not crypto exchanges in the first place.

Lame!

>>16202387

So why are you asking questions then?

>>16202401

Do you know what censorship resistant means or are you a brainless moron? I think i know the answer already. Lol.

>>16202387
>VirWox
You don't buy crypto with PayPal on there, you buy Linden dollars (Second Life currency) with PayPal and then trade those Linden dollars for crypto. The fee is like 20% because of this by the way.
The rest as far as I know like Paxful rely on PayPal not finding out that it's a crypto transfer, if they find out they lock the accounts.

>>16202403
https://paxful.com/
https://cancoin.co/
https://wirexapp.com/
https://www.etoro.com/

still functional, still can buy bitcoin with paypal. You still offered 0 proof so far. sad

>>16202422
so where is the proof? where did Paypal say crypto is now allowed?

>>16202403

Just ignore this noob asking noob questions and stating noob arguments. He’ll learn one day

>>16202435
t.brainless moron that got BTFO

>>16202397
I have charged people back before, that's part of the reason why I know it works.
>>16202432
Read the Terms of Service.

>>16201735
WikiLeaks

>>16202423
>no PayPal
>Marketplace closed
>no PayPal for crypto
>not even a crypto exchange

Very LAME

>>16202444
so you don't have proof? call me again when you get the proof

>>16202448
>11 replies
>still 0 proof
thats just SAD

>>16202455
You can find the Terms of Service readable online.
Now take care neurotic kike glownigger.

>>16202419
Your shithole country arguments solely for bitcorn falls flat on its ass. Nothing easier than spam and congest the network by a big player that wants to prevent it being used as a capital control evading tool. Bitcorns have no future, especially not as muah [insert buzzword]

>>16202471
if you can find it so easily why dont you post it then moron?

>>16202476

Ok noob. Go post about it on your blog

>>16202478

Haha why are you so salty about the fact that some people made a lot of money on something you don’t understand?

>>16201735

You are an obvious noob due to the types of replies and questions you are asking, may i ask how you stumbled onto our forum and why you are so mad at bitcoin? It’s very amusing.

>>16202535
lmao retard I made far more money on altcoins than you could ever make on king shitcoin. stay dumb and poor

>>16202566
you realize there are IDs here right newfag? lmao

>>16202568

Oh a shitcoin noob? Nice, you’ll learn.

>>16202575

Ummm thats why i checked yours and read all your replies to see how green you are. It’s pretty obvious and pathetic. You’re seething because you lost money on alts probably and now you lash out

>>16202280
>glowingniggers
Is this from the guy that created Jesus's god OS? Nice that at least something remained after him, RIP

>>16202581
I will be here laughing when bitcoin won't even be in top 20 coins in 5 years and you will be here begging for donations
>>16202588
stop embarassing yourself newfag, maybe try rddit you will fit better there

>>16202600

Lol. New as fuck and you still don’t understand bitcoin after buying the 2017 top and having 2 years to figure it out? Extremely SAD and transparent to why you are lashing out.

>>16201735
so, what did it take to sell your soul?

>>16202606
lmao its so obvious that you missed the x1000 altcoin pump while you were bagholding bitcorn and now you are seething af lmao

>>16202619

>buying altcoins
>saying altcoins will replace btc soon
>saying i’m the bag holder

>>16201735
Be my own bank

>>16202629
>bagholder keeps seething
lmao stay poor

>>16201735
not have anyone take it away from me

>>16201882
PayPal freezes your money for 6 months idiot

I've had multiple PayPal accounts doing transactions highly against their TOS since 2005. They freeze the money for 6 months each time.

That being said, I'm in favor of crypto, just don't spread false information like a faggot

>>16202640

Post your alt bag portfolio for us lmfao

>>16202640

Is this you???

>>16202661
>>16202678
seriously how many gains you lost because you never bought any alts? judging from your seething I'd say alot lmao dumb poorfag

>>16202692

Please post your bags. Stop ignoring reality new friend.

>>16202695
keep seething buddy, it wont make you less poor lmao

>>16202692

>alt coin gains
>btc will be out of the top coins soon

Yaaaaa sounds like you lost your life savings on alts

>>16202702
>replies twice to same post
lmao, just how butthurt are you buddy

>>16202701

But i’m not poor and you’re still a seething shitcoiner about to get even more rekt than you already probably are. Lol.

dab on /biz/

>>16202707

>omg he replied to a post 2 times

Lol how seething can one man get? You’re trolling yourself man. Put the bottle down, sell the alts. Life will get better i promise.

>>16202708
why do you lie on the internet buddy? its obvious from your seething that you are poor lmao. and you will be even more poor when king shitcoin finally gets replaced lmao

>>16201735
Get manipulated by the chinks and commit suicide when you get liquidated

>>16202649
You don't always get it back.
If you don't have a bank account attached to your account when it happens it's even less likely.
You don't know what you're talking about.

>>16202717

>i’m the one lying on the internet

Creg? Is that you?!?!!

>>16202715
>>16202723
lmao stay deluded poorfag. I am sure a few normies that heard crypto for the first time might buy a few bitcoin to pump your bags, then you will probably kill yourself when they all dump it for better crypto

>>16202726

>better crypto

How fucking new can one man be? Thanks for the keks man

>>16202744
>he doesn't know
oh wow. I actually almost feel bad for you

>>16202754

Oh trust me. I know. Lol.

Keep buying those alts bro! To the moon!

>>16202761
I am sure you do pal.
keep buying bitcon, its like the new global currency dude!

>>16201735
Shitpost in gay threads that people keep bumping for some reason

>>16202374
>aw fuck bro better buy up

You faggots are beyond stupid. The bubble burst and all that's left are hodlers and bulls trying to squeeze the market. It's already over. Sell while you can. All that ever kept this thing alive was fomo. It will never replace hard currency ever. They would literally round you all up and murder you before they let that happen, and regulate you out of existence. If you think it will happen, I feel sorry for your low level of intelligence.

>>16202772

It’s super funny how mad you are at bitcoin, these next 10-20 years are going to be so fun. You might as well be a nocoiner. Lol have a great night, i’m crashing out.

>>16202803

This again? We aren’t selling faggot. Anyways, go hang out with the other newfag shitcoiner that posted this thread. See you fellas at $100k

>>16202808
lmao I screenshoted your dumb reply. Gonna put as screensaver when your outdated shitcoin goes below top 50. stay dumb and poor pal

travel with 5 million $ on a usb

be a crypto NEET retired at 30 yo

>>16201735
You can buy unregulated drugs and firearms for your deep web purchased child slaves

>>16201778
I live in Russia, and almost all my clients are from EU or USA. And I can say from my experience that every one payment through PayPal is a pain in the ass. Every single time they have new bug or rule, or something else, that make my ass burn like a hell. When clients pay with BTC, it is just a few clicks for them. For me, this is about 1-2 hours to get money without any problems. And about 1-2 hours, it is extremely fast.

With PayPal you can easily wait for days or weeks - All that sudden confirmations of the identity, bug fixes, hold periods and other shit.

So for sending money abroad, there is nothing better than BTC.

And for payment for my precious White Widow of course.

>>16203474
I'm a Wendys chef making 40k/year. AMA

>>16201735
I literally can't. It's not even anonymous like shills claimed it to be.