/biz/ - Business & Finance

You're irrelevant and treated as such

truth is, there's too many people on this planet. too many retards out there to take care of. shitty fast food job was never supposed to be enough to support a home and family, it's supposed to be a fucking after school extra spending money job.

>>15536223
this speaks to me
What I never got is how people can complain about social services spending and tax rebates for poor but not want min wage to keep people out of qualifying for those programs.
Americans hate poor. Notice how we will lock up illegal immigrant babies but never punish Trump for hiring illegal maids and gardeners. We could end immigration by fining companies $1 million per illegal hire and enforcing it. It will never even be suggested to increase business' punishment. That's why they want a wall because it won't work.

That was before women were allowed in the workplace though

had enough of arguing the point
let retards die

>>15536275
This.

Double the worker supply while not increasing the demand. Hmm I wonder how this will affect wages...

>>15536270
it speaks to you because you are poor and have never had to make it past the government assistance threshold. the middle class is fucking wiped out from having to take care of you cunts. our quality of life is probably not all that different (expect you probably have way better health insurance than me), even though I make way more than you and have spent a lot longer grinding my way up the ladder.

>>15536261
then why do the elite fight us on birth control, sex ed, condoms are essential for public health, they should always be free. no one fucks because they have a condom, we fuck because we can, condom or not. No abortions from the elite, not because religion because more poor means we compete harder for jobs. Japan recruits and gives more to their workers because they have to. America takes the person willing to work for the least, you get the least effort.
I want food handlers to be not miserable at work and fast food should cost more than cooking a meal.

>>15536312
I want robots handling my food desu.

>>15536300
introducing women to the workplace barely affected real monetary income; it just destroyed the family and opened the floodgates to absolutely disastrous workplace legislation, led to more single person households (which does decrease real wages) and was almost all-around useless because all of the valuable things which women used to do just got put on the market instead of in the family

It is not up to society to take care of you. Ultimately the responsibility lies in oneself

>>15536330
[by which i mean that participation of more people working in a country doesn't make that country poorer. this is a fallacy to be avoided because it discourages large families]

>>15536312
>fast food should cost more than cooking a meal
It already does. I feed myself three meals a day for about $3

>>15536223
Why are we talking about wagie cagies when the real evil is inflation?

can you imagine being in high school already making $30k a year working at McDonalds after class? that's crazy to me. raising the minimum wage does nothing for everyone else who isn't a failed adult though. it make life harder for everyone when $30 is the new poor and everything else gets more expensive because of it and middle class wages still haven't gone up.

>>15536330
>doubling the supply of workers does not affect wages

>>15536223
>pretends that someone's work is worth more than it is, and pays them accordingly
>does this increasingly for over a century as industries collapse and poverty grows
>blames anyone who says that the minimum wage is bad of being "the problem" and "greedy" and "evil capitalists" etcetera
>literally would force everyone in society no matter where they are or how much they want nothing to do with him and his economics to abide by his $15/hr minimum wage laws, with no escape
collectivism is fucking retarded and everyone gets what they deserve

>>15536337
The purpose of a society is to protect the weak. Social groups evolved to provide increased safety and resources to their members through synergy and co-operation compared to solitary living

>>15536270
I'm personally for rounding up welfare recipients (except for fertile 7/10+ wamen without children) and marching them on foot 18 hrs a day to the mexican border and throwing them out of the country. Stragglers will be shot.

>>15536372
>can you imagine being in high school already making $30k a year working at McDonalds after class
Except they wouldn't be working anywhere near enough hours to earn $30k a year.

>>15536375
real wages, not nominal wages
increasing the supply of labour doesn't have any particular effect on real wages per capita; the effect can be positive or negative and it's not possible to ascertain which beforehand

>>15536404
problem is the scale of this. that's how families and tight knit communities operate. the US is way to big for this kind of ideology though obviously.

>>15536223
The problem is that they claim this but at the same time don't understand that this is a direct consequence of opening the labor market to world wide immigration. Instead of letting companies compete for a limited supply of employees they opened the floodgates to an inexhaustible supply of cheap laborers.

>>15536404
every society prior to ours gave out charity on a case-by-case basis which necessarily included strict adherence to certain norms. if those norms weren't adhered to, charity was broken off and the person was left to themselves. our experiment of giving people things indiscriminately has led to a society of people who have never had an incentive to behave according to social norms. this is irreversible, it will stay with us until our entire society collapses.

>>15536408
I was working full time in high school, it's not that uncommon. evenings and weekends. i wasn't retarded enough to think that it should be enough for me to buy a house and support a family though. it was week money and rent split between me and 4 friends. that kind of shit job is a temp situation. when you grow up and need to make more money, you find a job that actually pays you. adults working fast food jobs into their 30s-40s have fucking failed at life. where's the drive to improve? I'm not responsible for their shitty life, no one is but themselves.

>>15536438
An increase in the availability of labour also proportionally increases the internal market, creating more jobs to meet demand.

>>15536306
See retards like you always parrot the same garbage talking point that the middle class is wiped out because some small amount goes to sheboons raising a couple niglets. And yeah a couple pennies on the dollar goes there, but you never look at how so much of your tax money goes to arming Saudis Arabia, or arming Israel, or giving money to corporations. That's a much much bigger piece of the pie and you're focused on some stupid shit.

>>15536404
The reason for collectives to exist is to protect and represent the interests of its members. It is impossible in this world for an individual to compete with a collective, no matter how strong or intelligent he is. Therefore the formation of social bodies is inevitable as long as man have things they want to protect.

>>15536434
What evidence do you have to support this? At what scale does society become inherently inefficient?
The USA is not a single entity, there are many sub -divisions with varying degrees of autonomy at state, county and city level. Are these all inefficient too due to their scale?

>>15536306
Not true...I agree with him hole heartedly and I am very well off. Been raised fairly comfortable in an upper middle class household where my parents brought in combined 250k a year in the 90s and in the early 2000s. Own multiple homes in different cities and everyone in my immediate family runs a small business that brings in enough profit to support ourselves.

>>15536485
If this were true there could never exist an oversupply of labor, this is clearly not the case. For this to be correct the immigrated individual would have to already possess wealth in order to be able to create proportional demand in consumer products.

>>15536223
A liveable wage doesn’t break the system. Endlessly printing money to fund wars for bankers to profit from does. If you end the FED and the ability to endlessly print fiat, you wouldn’t need to raise the minimum wage. Raising the minimum wage is a very temporary solution to the problem, and you will have the same problem in 5-10 years. Attack the problem at the source, the Federal Reserve.

>>15536609
Learn economics, bro. And reset your Youtube algorithm.

>>15536275
woman were allowed to work certain jobs it just wasn't necessary even 2 min wages can't buy a house and support a family, most cities need 2 min wage workers for a 1 bedroom apartment and 2 used cars. Your argument is so far from reality and still makes his point.
>>15536300
More workers does increase demand for employees by increasing spending, most american's are so far in debt increases in wages will be eaten up by paying off bills. Real wages haven't grown in 40 years in the US but productivity is through the roof.
>>15536306
fuck you I'm white and never got a govt check. I worked jobs with immigrants as a housekeeper and construction worker until BTC let me buy rental property and quit my casino job.
You'll probably never make what I make from my rental property or dropshipping store. I find growth and put $100 a week for 2 years before my crypto took off.
I know that workers are on welfare and walmart gets tax cuts. I'm tired of paying for billionaires to hire welfare workers. If you work you shouldn't qualify for welfare in this country.

You're so retarded because you think min wage in america should keep you on welfare. Working 40 hours a week should keep you poor? Not when CEO crash and bankrupt companies to bleed tax payers for more tax cuts. The problem isn't the tiny amount taken from the bottom, fuck they need it and spend it more. The problem is the rich pay politicians to write laws in their favor at the expense of the national budget
>>15536329
me too and then will have UBI but it can't be a shock to the system, we need more small businesses and opportunities for middle class workers because they're they only ones paying fucking taxes, poor take, rich take more than they give and then elect guys like trump to write the tax laws.
>>15536337
that's why you raise min wage. Bezos didn't pay state or local sales tax for 15 years through amazon, but god forbid we pay waiters and bartenders enough to live off their employers wages.

>>15536312
Totally fine, as long as people who don't take advantage of these offers (free condoms etc) get their money back later on. Shouldn't be hard to enact with blockchain and co, either, huh? Everyone gets his/her fair share and gets to decide how to spend it.

>>15536312
>they should always be free
Why do people say free when they always mean publicly funded? This shit is not free at all and it is political and deceptive to describe it as such

>>15536624
You are the one who needs to learn economics. Inflation of the money supply is not necessary for economic growth. Thats brainlet tier brainwashing.

>>15536740
Inflation is not created by the central bank you mong. Prices rise as a result of economic expansion. Printing money is a mechanism for stimulating growth or reigning in an over-extended economy.

What you're referring to only happens in authoritarian regimes where the supreme leader prints money INDISCRIMINATELY

>>15536791
Holy fuck you cannot be this retarded. 10/10 bait. Rustled my jimmies good.

>>15536223
>the bare minimum income should be enough to live the american dream of having a home in the suburbs and raising a family
what a moron. minimum wage is enough to rent in a shared apartment/home with 2-3 other tenants and support a single person, or live in a trailer off in the woods and buy an old beater to get you back and forth to work

>>15536261
Agreed. "Livable wage" and "Breaking the system" are just the cries of worthless people who can't accept the reality of their own worthlessness.

>>15536821
You're delusional, and you didn't address any of my points. I'll chalk it up as a concession

>>15536223
The point of minimum wage was to keep blacks out of the work force

>>15536837
what minimum wage is and what it should be are different concepts Cleetus

>>15536406
secret fags love camo and the military. go join the navy and suck a dick act like you want hot women. So easily to find the closet queer
>>15536456
the goal is to get them better so they add value to the tax base, you idiots can't understand a budget. Welfare turns people from suckers to workers and the country was worse off before worker and social programs were enacted. They gave us the golden age of the 50's along with decreased competition from europe. Japan passed us in $ value because they printed and then spent wisely public funds. You guys need to read about the bank of japan.
>>15536467
The drive to improve is innate in some of us. We all aren't lazy pieces of shit like you
>>15536734
it's a better use of funds than the free guns and planes we send the arabs and jews in the middle east.
You fucktards freak out over $1's but let billions get lost by the pentagon. That shit was given to foreigners btw. Where's your outrage at keeping failing companies and banks going? Conservatives are only fiscally tight with americans, they love giving money to israel. Trump king of the jews now and they ignore the banks effect on inflation

>>15536791
you idiot he said supply inflation not price inflation and they're extremely related btw
>>15536837
still cant raise a family on it

>>15536848
Read “Applied Economics: Thinking Beyond Stage One” by Thomas Sowell. He explains this simple enough for a brainlet of your caliber to understand. As for addressing your “points”...
>pic related
Which supreme leader printed our money indiscriminately?

>>15536848
i answered it for him, you dumbfuck
>>15536872

>>15536872
That's exactly my point, egghead. Inflation is caused by many factors; printing money (in relatively democratic societies) is not the primary (or even tertiary) cause of inflation. Only conspiracy nuts believe this, which is why no one takes them seriously

>>15536916
This is basic supply and demand you moron. Its economics 101. What happens to the value of ANYTHING as the supply increases if demand remains the same?

>>15536916
Also, are you calling Thomas Sowell a “conspiracy nut”? He is probably the most qualified living economist on the planet.

>>15536859
>it's a better use of funds than the free guns and planes we send the arabs and jews in the middle east.
>You fucktards freak out over $1's but let billions get lost by the pentagon. That shit was given to foreigners btw. Where's your outrage at keeping failing companies and banks going? Conservatives are only fiscally tight with americans, they love giving money to israel. Trump king of the jews now and they ignore the banks effect on inflation
Wow look at all the assumptions you are making you straw manning fucktard. Of course I disagree with the Pentagon's losing money. Of course we shouldn't be fighting Israel's wars. You are a disingenuous little fuck and arguing in extremely bad faith if you sincerely believe that anyone actually believes it is a good thing that the Pentagon loses billions of dollars.

I just want you socialist faggots to call things what they are: publicly funded. This is is NOT FUCKING FREE. Calling it free is political and deceptive, that's literally all I said. Do you really disagree with that?

>>15536880
Wow. You're confusing hyper-inflation (which is bad) with normal, healthy and economically stimulating inflation (which is unavoidable and good). There's nothing alarming about that graph. Do you really believe money should increase in value over time? Sounds like a great way for the economy to stagnate

>>15536936
Yeah, pretty much. He's a libertarian's wet dream. It's all trickle down BS

>>15536925
THAT'S THE FUCKING POINTS! Demand doesn't stay the same you nut!

I hate to pull rank, but do you have a Masters in economics? Or are you just parroting shit you've been spoonfed from libertarian think tanks and ZeroHedge?

>>15536960
Read the book moron. He addresses EXACTLY that point. Thats not how shit works AT ALL. Im done with this conversation because Im still not convinced that you arent trolling.

>>15536990
If demand increased along with supply you wouldnt see the dollar lose purchasing power like it shows in the graph. You are contradicting yourself. You dont have a masters in economics. I guarantee it.

>>15536859
no, if you're in your 30s and are working at a fast food joint making minimum wage, you either have no drive to improve, or you just got out of prison and are paying for bad choices. you don't get stuck at a minimum wage job for 15 years while actually trying to make your situation better.

>>15536628
yeah well, keep me the fuck out of it. this whole dance is always just between the ultra rich and the poor, but then the solutions they agree to only impact those of us in the middle. what does raising the minimum wage do for me? makes $30k the new poverty and everything else gets more expensive while middle class wages stagnate for another 10 years.

>>15536559
start at the family level. that's my immediate circle. if I can't afford to take care of them in the way that they truly deserve, I'm going to be bitter as fuck about being told to pay my share of some cunt i've never met's health insurance subsidy. everyone is broke, this is what you fags don't get. we're all broke, some of us just have to pay $700 a month for health insurance while others get it for free. we make money, but we're broke! all the way up to upper middle class >250k a year incomes. even then, depending on where they live and how many dependants they have, that might not even be much.

>>15536998
Why don't you save me the agony of leafing through your propaganda book and just tell me in plain English how you think it works?

>>15537012
Yes that's exactly what you would see because the supply of the dollar will never be able to keep up with the constant upward push on prices caused by economic growth (eg. demand slowly outpaces supply). There's no contradiction unless you believe that the central bank is the only thing that causes inflation.

>>15536960
>>15536975
>>15536990
These memes are as cringe as your belief that the economy should be driven by wants instead of needs. Deflation is good and keeps us grounded in reality, which is why I'd wager you closet statists despise the gold standard. Welcome back to the middle ages motherfucker.

>>15537055
>>15537012
And like I stated before; the sole exception is if some dictator or authoritarian regime gets control of the printing press and goes HAM. The central bank is a tool, it's not inherently good or bad.

>>15536916
no it is the primary cause and economists are returning more towards demographics and hard numbers instead of silly models that blow up in the real world.
Go to sleep, you look stupid with every post you make
>>15536944
fuck you conservatives are the real welfare socialists, tax breaks for churches and companies, unchecked defense spending, and fractional reserve are the real reasons we can't have nice shit in America. I disagree because I understand Fiat is backed by nothing, the cost of computer clicks is essentially free. >>15536990
dude youre real stupid, demand can go up and down or stay the same. He's giving an general example fuck man
>>15536960
Dude sign off now before you hurt your brain. You think inflation is necessary because you were raised that way. You think people will starve and miss out on investing to make a tiny%. That's how silly your whole platform is. People will horde until we die so lets all go in debt.
Deflationary system is probably healthier because it encourages saving, humans never need to be encouraged to spend you dumbfucks
you fell for the banks meme that deflation is bad. Keep holding dollars in your bank accounts, nothing to worry about here.

>>15537070
Nothing like some weak-ass ad hominem to show that you're definitely winning the discussion.

It's not about what it SHOULD be driven by you retard, it's what it actually IS driven by. It's not a fucking value statement

>>15537094
Like i said... done with this conversation. You are either trolling, or you are so incredibly far in the wrong that trying to get you to see the light would be a fools errand. Agreeing to disagree, whatever you want to call it. I just hope that someone out there who read my posts ITT will do some research on the topic.

>>15537024
>does raising the minimum wage do for me
this is it right here, this is conservatives in a nutshell. Cry babies who want to stay home and get welfare but can't invest smart enough to quit. I have no sympathy for idiots like this who don't realize they gain from a min wage increase because it takes money spent on foreign goods, assets, and employees and keeps it mostly here.

People work jobs for so many reason's and you're so simple minded you think all min wage workers had all the easy breaks you got. You can't conceptualize others struggles so you think everyone had it easy like your crybaby ass.
Fuck you that's what you get from a min wage increase because you're too stupid to understand economic pros and cons at a basic level.

>>15537115
In one paragraph you talk about silly models that blow up and in the next you defend that other retards "an general example" which has nothing to do with the real world.

You're way out of your depth here. Inflation is not "necessary" whatever the fuck that means, it is INHERENT to modern economics. Deflation is way more dangerous that inflation, ask any economist (even your bought-and-paid-for libertarian ones will tell you this)

>>15537132
fucking larped like he had a masters in econmics

>>15537132
>muh ad hominem
Don't start being a whiny little bitch already because your gifs are cringe af lol
>It's not about what it SHOULD be driven by you retard, it's what it actually IS driven by. It's not a fucking value statement
What it *is* driven by under real money is needs. Source: 1300 years of history starting with the silver denier. Your travesty of money called fiat currency doesn't change that reality.

>>15537177
Calling people who disagree with you "trolls" is a solid indicator that maybe you should try going outside your bubble before you're completely trapped in it.

>>15536261
fpbp

>>15537200
>ask any economist (even your bought-and-paid-for libertarian ones will tell you this)
They'll also say that debt to GDP over 100% is fine for the US and 200% fine for japan and china.
inflation doesn't have to be inherent and deflation is probably a healthier system. Slow and steady inflation like gold or BTC mimics deflation based on increased demand. Those are probably healthier currencies than the dollar.
Fiat inflation encourages debt and saving is healthier for society when times get hard. Debt is great for growth but it's 2 steps forward one step back.

You can't think outside what you know. You think advanced economic models are the same as the relationship of supply and demand. You didnt even understand him clearly but you continue to pretend to be informed

>>15537243
And endlessly posting cringey ancient image macro memes in a desperate attempt to seem like you fit in to the culture of an anonymous Mongolian cheese squeezing blog is a solid indicator that your last name ends in the suffix -stein or -berg.

>>15537273
Forgot one. -blatt

>>15537214
I think you're confusing disbelief with whining. My gifs are glorious and you know it :*

Yeah you're right: we should just go back to exchanging shiny metals. That'll solve all the worlds' problem and make everything unicorns and rainbows.

Get a fucking grip dude, you're living in la la land

>>15537187
what the fuck are you even talking about? I'm coming up from 0. I know all about it cause I used to live on minimum wage. now I make $75k but my quality of life has barely improved from $30k. you think raising the minimum wage will simply make welfare programs disappear, I don't. it just makes $15/hr the new poverty level and the cuttoffs are lifted for all the benefits. raising the minimum wage isn't going to make it so that everyone can afford what they need, it's going to make everything more expensive. you're burger isn't going to stay the same price if the small business owner has to double eveyones hourly rate that he's paying. the price of everything goes up. poor people are still poor. the middle class has stayed in the same place, while the water around them just rose another 10ft. go fuck yourself

>>15537273
Yeah, you got me good there. Guess I'll just leave

Minimum wages and the innevitable hikes only gives companies more power in suppressing wages.

Raising the minimum wage won't do anything except shift where the poverty line is. This is all a matter of (appropriately, and more often than not, rightfully) poor people thinking selfishly, which makes sense considering that poverty is fueled by reckless selfishness - vice, etc. There will be demand for wage increases across the board in response, and thus prices on goods and services goes up as a result. Ultimately, you haven't done anything but devalue the currency already in circulation, and just given more of it to people who are dumb enough to think that "more money = wealth", and then they'll complain again a few years down the road saying that $15 isn't enough and now needs to be $20, ad nauseum. Simple economics, dumb people.

>>15537303
Funny, for someone who seemingly wants to be held to rational standards, you make zero compelling against a monetart system that has carried our civilization for centuries, and in fact resort to dismissive analogies hoping it will make up for actual argument. I'm sure you think it's obsolete and antiquated because reasons/funny libeling.

>>15537333
checked. not sure why this is so hard for biz to understand.

>>15537187
How do people making 20 an hour benefit from a hike to 15?

>>15537263
High debt means you're a trusted debtor, that's all it is, which means yes, it is fine. Please explain to me why taking on debt is bad (and don't give me the "collapse of the dollar" meme; you'll have far greater worries than some debt if that happens)

>>15537303
Funny, for someone who seemingly wants to be held to rational standards, you make zero compelling argument against a proven monetary system that has carried our civilization for centuries.
Instead you resort to dismissive namecalling hoping it makes up for actual arguments. I'm sure you think it's obsolete and antiquated because reasons/funny libeling.

>>15537333
Not true. Raising the minimum wage will redistribute wealth from shareholders and upper management to the workers. There's no "new money" involved.

>>15537382
Yeah, government intervention always wins over the invisible hand of the market. Just look at how well rent control works. New York, and San Francisco are shining examples of that. Raising the minimum wage surely wont result in any negative consequences 10 years from now whatsoever.

>>15537373
You didn't make an argument though, you simply stated deflation is good and cited "1300 years of history". "What it is driven by under real money is needs"? What the fuck does that mean?

>>15536261

That shitty fast food job requires 100x more effort than most white collar jobs. We reward people who sit on their ass and draw retarded meme lines on a chart to predict a system that they themselves invented. The system is broken because we are rewarding Wall Street gamblers who contribute nothing of substance rather than physical labor which provides 100% substance. I made six figures this year investing in a cube meme coin. How is that not a flawed system?

>>15537382
kek, yeah, redistribute wealth from small business owners who are already struggling. large corporations will just invest in automating the work. you're a fucking idiot. you cunts always want to frame this as a 1% vs. the 99%...but your solutions don't fucking touch the 1%. it just screws your neighbor.

>>15537382
Companies always shift things out to a net zero though. Pay raises for the few, not everyone as a lot get locked into 20 hours a week or get fired.

>>15537409
If you want to gaze into your crystal ball and feel good about yourself, that's fine I guess. But that's got nothing to do with what the other anon was arguing.

>>15536261
Maybe if you left the somalians that have 12 kids each in their own country you wouldn't have this problem

>>15537382
Raising minimum wage simply prices unskilled labourers out of the market, preventing them from developing the skills they need to move to more senior, well-paying positions in the future.

>>15537415
That shitty fast food job took millions of dollars in research to abuse the human body as much as possible while keeping Accuracy and speed up. Also, stress =/= effort. The burger flippers are risking pennies, you're risking thousands.

>>15537382
This. Businesses print unlimited money that the greedy shareholders all keep. They don't have expenses or competition, and people's ability to buy their products is arbitrary. No one is ever hired because of competence or the ability to produce for the company, it's all just white people hiring each other to keep the black man down. Once the businesses are required to give everyone a $15 an hour job, all that will end and no one will be unemployed and poverty will disappear.

>>15537415
no it doesn't. you are absolutely delusional. you're obviously never had a real job if you think fast food work is hard or requires more effort that a real fucking career.
you made 6 figures investing in link....congrats. don't confuse that for a job though retard. you're whole argument is about what I would expect from a linkie.

>>15537432
I did. I don't even know any somalians anon. come at me with something real

Money doesn't feed anyone bread does. Minimum essentials like bread, water, housing and healthcare makes much more sense on every level.

>>15537382
>Raising the minimum wage will redistribute wealth from shareholders
Notice the keyword here: *will*. Let's totally forget about the last 20 times we've done this in developped countries. I think I'm starting to see a trend with this one: what hasn't worked in the past will work in the future! But when govt stopped what used to work in the past suddenly this can no longer work in the future! That's called insanity dude.

>>15537434
No, it fast-forwards the elimination of menial jobs to automation, forcing the work-force to expand their skillset to gain employment. It's like ripping of a band-aid in one quick move as opposed to a slow and more painful process.

>>15536409

The US ran on a system of labor scarcity for 300 years and was continually improving living standards up until the 70s-80s when it became socially acceptable for women to be breadwinners, and then it all went to shit. It would appear that in this case, the effect of doubling the labor force on real wages per capita was significantly negative.

>>15537449
I've worked in factories, gas stations, done finance in skyscrapers, even owned my own firm. The more money the worse the job is, unless you take extreme satisfaction in all the attention and importance associated with it, which I never did. When you have $15k in payroll to pay on Friday with $8k in the company bank account on Tuesday, you begin to realize that you never even knew what stress was until you got there. I dreamed of going back to run an assembly line for $16 an hour. None of that material shit was worth what those jobs did to my mental and physical health.

>>15537445
wow you totally demolished that strawman

>>15537313
>poor people are still poor. the middle class has stayed in the same place, while the water around them just rose another 10ft. go fuck yourself
damn you're really a fuck tard.
Prices go up anyway this needs to be done to keep up or else I have to live around trash, we all do.
What don't you guys get about lifting up the bottom gives you the most bang for your $?
You can't save because you're an idiot. I never rose above a 30k a year job but flipped crypto to retirement before my mom could.
I took 30k job in vegas and flipped it into rental townhomes. My job is setting up rental agreements and searching redfin.
Poor you little baby will have to pay over a buck for a burger. Good fat fucks here need to stop buying fast food so much, soda too, we need to tax this shit before universal healthcare so i dont pay for republicans to eat big macs and have heart attacks, mostly fat fucks from the south anyways
>>15537333
This is the biggest economic fallacy repeated here today.

You are so stupid you think Mc donalds charges what it costs to make.
Iphone's will still sell for $999 and Big macs will still cost $5.99 even with min wage doubled, the difference would be negligible at best.
Studies show min wage increases buying and lowers costs of most goods. Min wage increases lead to more hiring and less overtime.
Cities with the highest min wage have they most jobs and employment. I'd say min wage is more an effect of those economies but by your logic min wage is the major economic factor

>>15537467
Well it actually has worked in other developed countries. The US is shit-tier compared to industrialized Europe according to most all measures of human development. What's your point?

>>15537462
The catch is decades from now when your grocery bill is thousands of dollars every month

>>15537473
>automation
You spelled exporting our labor to 3rd world shitholes wrong.

>>15537498
Funny how I can disagree with you so heavily on that other thing but completely agree with you on this.

>>15537473
>forcing the work-force to expand their skillset to gain employment
and how do they do that without the opportunity to work? Why doesn't everyone do that now and we can all work in high-paying skilled jobs?

>>15537524
Well that too, obviously.

Bottom line is shitty jobs will slowly go away.

>>15537498
Weren't Iphones only 800-900 originally? Weren't bigmacs a lot less than 5.99? Why are these prices higher now?

>>15537498
you don't get to talk about the grind of making real money if you just got lucky flipping crypto. you never even rose above 30k. that means your health insurance was still heavily subsidized and if you have dependents, like I do, you'd even still qualify for food stamps and other benefits. you don't have any idea what you're talking about. going from 30k to crypto rich and you want to talk to me like you understand the plight of the middle class in america. mother fucker, I make $75k a year and just had to pull my own god damn tooth out last month cause I can't go to a god damned dentist. I don't qualify for any kind of sliding scale payment or free service.

>>15536275
This

>>15537552
Because the companies who produce those goods know that you’ll shell out more than 800/900 or 5.99 respectively for the same product. Supply and demand. Consumers drive price fluctuation more than any act of the fed. Want prices to go down? Don’t buy product.

>>15537536
Because the US education system is highly privatized and as a result insanely expensive and because there's stigma attached to going back to school if you're 30+.

What skills do you learn flipping burgers or maneuvering customers at Wall-Mart? It's bullshit, there's virtually no upwards mobility in these types of jobs

>>15537582
Do you agree with his statement about wages not impacting price though?

>>15537552
Is this a trick question? The answer is inflation

>>15537258
Idiot

>>15537555
Checked

Move out of Cali or Seattle

>>15537593
I do agree, but that impact pales in comparison to companies individually adjusting prices based on demand.

>>15537582
This.

Oh my god, there are actually sane people ITT.

>>15537596
http://haywardeconblog.blogspot.com/2014/05/mcdonalds-menu-board-from-1974-nice.html?m=1
It would appear to not be the case...

>>15537620
Ok so inflation is only responsible for 72 PERCENT of the rise in prices. That's supposed do disprove my statement? Jesus christ...

>>15537549
No, not "obviously". If it were that obvious to you you wouldn't try to conflate the two together to convenientltly leave out the part where globalism is overwhelmingly responsible for gutting the middle class, while you again need to resort to hypotheticals and future predictions about a problem that has yet to fully manifest itself in compatable terms.

>>15537459
I don't mean you specifically retard

>>15537620
And no, the remaining increase is not due to higher wages (since I'm sensing that's what you're trying to shill). This anon explained it succinctly:
>>15537582

>>15537350
more business
>>15537353
debt is bad when income is constricted, debt during expansion can be good, debt during hard times can be bad.
Did you ask why debt is bad? Because you owe the bank money. I'm not religious but Jesus hated money changers and most ancient cultures considered debt evil because it lead to collapse and wars and poverty
>>15537382
>Raising the minimum wage will redistribute wealth from shareholders
ding ding ding.
Mcdonalds pays dividends with the $ saved on wages
>>15537409
too late their giving tax breaks to amazon and GE bro, this was never a free market and you look stupid for larping like 0% interest rates and trade deals are a free market. I could go on for days about govt intervention but no one cares when it keeps newbies like me from buying cheap stocks. invisible hand has always belonged to the govt
>>15537415
most min wage workers do more important work, like handling fucking food and work harder than every manager ever trained.
>>15537417
small businesses get rewarded in this system. Large employers already have automated what they can and they'll continue to do so without min wage increases
>>15537440
wrong, you can start a burger chain without millions in research. It's fucking food.
Those executives spent millions but took more in taxes to run their business.Acting like fortune 500 companies aren't 90% communist drains on the tax payer. Wake up. McDonalds wouldn't spend millions on researching mcribs if they had to pay burger flippers their fair share
>>15537473
You would argue that child labor laws would increase cost of goods and make farmers use more horses. So what you idiot, this is progress and that's why fdr passed the new deal, lbj passed medicare, etc. Social security, disability, welfare, healthcare, college, UBI it will happen, you can only delay progress.
>>15537474
bullshit We had high unemployment through many era's. The fed changed things and women had to work. Most women don't want to work you idiot.

>>15537664
I'm not conflating shit, you're just mad you lost our previous talk. Even if a country successfully regulates labor-exportation (which I agree is a good thing) and manages to retain all its jobs they will still eventually be subject to automation.

>>15537684
>You would argue that child labor laws would increase cost of goods and make farmers use more horses. So what you idiot, this is progress and that's why fdr passed the new deal, lbj passed medicare, etc. Social security, disability, welfare, healthcare, college, UBI it will happen, you can only delay progress.

No you're strawmaning me. I'm a progressive, I believe in a minimum wage AND in reducing outsourcing. I'd vote for Bernie if I was a US citizen

So your argument is debt is bad because Jesus says so? Debt you can't repay is obviously bad, debt in itself is not. Neither the US or Japan is in danger of defaulting any time soon.

>>15537651
It shows that wages could impact prices. Stop being confrontational and ignorant.

>>15537680
You need to prove that statement then.

>>15537684
Debt the government has is not the same as debt that you and I have. The "debt" the government has is more like leverage.

>>15537684
>small businesses get rewarded in this system.
explain. how are small businesses rewarded by having to double their payroll expenses?
>Large employers already have automated what they can and they'll continue to do so without min wage increases
they haven't already automated what they can, only what's cost effective. what's the cost/benefit ratio of automating a task today? ask again after doubling the hourly rate of the worker...
I'm all for that as a side effect though desu. we should be automating as much shit work as possible. we need to come up with a rebalance our society though that doesn't just make everyone except the robot owner poor.

There should be no minimum wage

>>15537752
It also shows that the invention of the Internet could impact prices. Or that skinny jeans could impact prices. See my point? The remaining 28% could be caused by a plethora of things; your source doesn't explore any of them.

>>15537522
haha should have thought of that before you let republicans and democrats bail out the banks
>>15537552
not because wages went up, because new money was put in the system. Rich people have you thinking money supply doesn't affect prices more than wages.>>15537555
wrong state buddy. 35k is double min wage here. I never qualified for food stamps and benefits, i checked once. If i had kids yes.
>>15537555
poor baby stop complaining. I paid for my health insurance out of pocket or with union dues If you make 75k you can afford any dental work out of pocket. stop acting like you have it hard you pussy ass wimp
>>15537582
feds control money supply, the most important supply

>>15536406
>I'm personally for rounding up welfare recipients (except for fertile 7/10+ wamen without children) and marching them on foot 18 hrs a day to the mexican border and throwing them out of the country. Stragglers will be shot.
Don't forget to *teleport* behind them too.

>>15536312
More people = more workers
Supply and demand of labor you fucking moron

>>15537787
You seem to be dead set on it not being wages though... which is interesting...

>>15537752
no it shows marketing increasing, real wage growth is slower than inflation but Mcdonalds profits increased since. CEO wages and dividends caused the price increase

>>15537790
nope, you're projecting your situation onto me. I pay 30k a year in rent and support a family of five. you think 75K is a lot of money when health insurance costs $700 a month? you identify with poor people and want to lift them up cause that's all you know. you don't know what middle class is like in america, and it shows. you're a kid...you don't know as much as you think you do.

>>15536223
If welfare didn't exist I would agree. Welfare is basically a living wage by another name.

>>15537807
>>15537807
No I'll acknowledge that it can impact prices, at least if the increase is large and sudden. See this:
https://www.upjohn.org/research-highlights/does-increasing-minimum-wage-lead-higher-prices

This is also a good place to start to dispel some misconceptions (Yes I know, Youtube as a source, but the content i correct):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_M3vTvm2cfM&t=220s

If done consistently and methodically a minimum wage increase will not jack up prices.

>>15536223
If you want to be able to have a home and family on minimum wage then we have to get rid of the nigger and Jew parasites that leech off our labour. It is impossible to have both. Socialists don’t understand this except for the based nationalist kind.

>>15537767
I agree fiat encourages consumer debt and both the country and consumers are at unhealthy levels according to most but those levels will only go up. Inflation encourages reckless behavior with money and rewards the risky
>>15537775
small businesses don't have as many min wage workers by % as large corps. They'll see increased business through the big places getting hit harder. You act like the small places pay less than walmart. Walmart and burgerr king get hurt, mom and pops already pay above min wage
>>15537782
or labor laws, ot laws or any protections from employers.
>>15537804
that's exactly what I said you dum dum, can you read?
>>15537807
they have an impact but you're overrating it. Markets are complex with many factors and you're trying to condense it to make it easier to understand. The dynamics are too numerous to say raising wages raise the prices of everything.

>>15537707
>you're just mad you lost our previous talk
I'm just seing your attempted deflection now. You're spewing out so much nonsense I don't even have time to keep up.
>You didn't make an argument though, you simply stated deflation is good and cited "1300 years of history". "What it is driven by under real money is needs"? What the fuck does that mean?
Yup retardation confirmed. Let's see, what part of hundreds of years of working western civilization do you not understand?
>"What it is driven by under real money is needs"
Maybe start thinking more than 10 sec abt what I write? Jesus fuck. Let me spell that out for you again. Under a silver/gold standard, i.e. money you can't swap for made up IOUs, you are restricted to what you can *really* afford. This restricts the emergence of financial bubbles that cyclically destroys entire generations, while preventing the development of an otherwise welfare state that renders the people completely dependent on the money printer. Finally, the need driven economy is inherently deflationary, so that people tend so save money for the future and spend it when they have to, not just because they *want* some fancy iPhone. This is how my grandparents already had a house at my age while my generation can barely afford rent. Liberals are terrified of deflationary economics because their utopian consumption based pipe dream cannot exist without their imaginary money tricks.

>>15537832
you just want everyone to feel sorry for you.
Your whole argument is I can't make it on 75k why should people under me get help.
Grow up, shouldn't have had a family you can't support. I bet you collected unemployment, disability, wic for your kids, or free healthcare while your wife was pregnant and if not you took govt check somewhere. No one feels bad for you when I saved and learned about crypto enough to retire before I got married and had kids. I want to earn more and then travel, i grew up poor with a mom who worked for welfare helping welfare people find jobs and my dad a trucker. I'm the whiteboy who moved out of LA and grinded working days and trading crypto at nights after I worked 2 jobs at the same time for a year.
Hispanics and blacks were the only people working with me as a housekeeper and instead of becoming a manager I invested in the right coins at the right time. You don't think that's work because you can't learn things like I do. I quit my shitty job because I worked harder than the africans I worked with for less than I make from crypto
I didn't blame anyone for my dead end jobs and lack of drive but when I found BTC I knew what to do. I had a lot of economics studying prior though so I was primed for BTC

>>15537884
You bring up some good points I guess. My problem is that it's so aspirational that I don't really know what the point in discussing it is. In the real world the economy works in a certain way. Inflation is an inherent attribute of economic growth. We should use regulations and policy (including the Central Bank) to remedy what capitalism gets wrong and to boost what it gets right. But you're talking about taking us back to the middle ages.

Let me put it like this: It's like you have a chair, but one leg is a bit too short. Do you add a small piece under the dysfunctional leg or do you saw them all down so there's slightly less chair left?

>>15537949
no dude, my argument is I'm having a hard enough time taking care of my own kids.
>you're mom should never have had you if she couldn't support you
I'm not responsible for taking care of adult fuck ups who never bettered their own situation. all you're suggestions put the burden of the poor on the middle class. that's not going to work for anyone. go fuck yourself. take care of your own mom. it's not societies job to do that for her.

>>15538027
welfare is temporary for most you act like they live on that shit. You act like you're giving too much in taxes and that means no one else should be given any help.
You can't imagine a world where things aren't paid for by the middle class. The reason the middle classes bruden is so large is because rich don't pay their share of taxes through loopholes and tax advantages and poor don't through lack and taking back large refunds. Min wage increases take people out of collecting benefits and puts them into paying more taxes and a higher %.
You lost me on the mom thing, mines just retired and collects a union pension not any social security. But society set up social security so we could take care of the old who couldn't take care of themselves. It's one of the best things our government has done

>>15538005
I like your more level headed answer so I'll take it from there. A sound monetary system is certainly not incompatible with growth. Hell we had silver quarters and dollars just a few decades ago! The truth is the US couldn't afford the cold war since the soviets were already cheating with money, nor should it have recovered from the great recession (itself created by a liquidity crisis) had it not been for monetary interventionism that was conveniently justified by secular shocks like "world wars". There is nothing wrong with slower growth as opposed to ravaging boom and bust cycles. In other words, gold and silver lets you only trade with 1x leverage, while fiat is a 100x casino. We know which is better, hence why I resort to history.

As for your chair analogy, the real question is how did we get a wobbling chair in the first place? I think you know the answer. But yes, I would take the loss and have a soft reset. Just like sometimes you need to get liquidated and start over with your trading position rather than delaying the inevitable by adding to your margin account to lower your liquidation price.

>>15538166
the increase in cost of labor is paid for by the consumer, it's not the wealthy paying their fair share. lifting the bottom just makes the new bottom include a larger number of people.
if we're going to have a safety net in place for the poor, it can't be at the expense of the middle class like it has been. you're the kind of guy who was arguing for Obama care like it wouldn't cost the rest of us anything. My health insurance premiums went way the fuck up while half the country gets their cost subsidized to some degree. I'm quite tired of this shit personally.

>>15538241
But I don't get how going back to gold and silver specifically will fix any of this? Why not just make leveraged borrowing (or borrowing and lending in general) illegal or restricted (i.e. patching capitalism)? Seems a much more realistic route than what you're advocating.

>>15536223
>the system "deserves" to be broken
Leftists exhibiting petulant vidictiveness toward a non-living abstract concept based on their feelings about how much stuff they should have. All leftist ideology is insane death cult nonsense.

>>15538365
The debt genie is out of the bottle. Financiers know that they can make endless amounts of money lending any dollar amount to anybody. It needs to be restricted, but it won't be.

>>15536312
>fast food should cost more than cooking a meal
I agree. I would rather spend more and not have terrible service. Wages have not kept up with inflation, so service has fallen dramatically.

>>15536312
>the "elites" are against recreational sex
If you really believe that conservative senators from the south are the top of the pyramid you should really try reading a fuckibg book. Or rather watch a Hollywood movie, that's the real instrument of their control

>>15536261
Too many old people. WE'RE JUST GONNA KILL 'EM

>>15536223
That's fucking wrong you idiot

Minimum wage can't make labor more valuable. If the value of the labor is less than minimum wage, no one will be hired or they will be given minimal hours. If it's greater, then the person will not be paid minimum wage.

Minimum wage can only lower employment. Most americans (96%) don't get paid minimum wage.

The premise of minimum wage has nothing to do with its effectiveness.

>>15538671
By saying value, do you mean market value, or the value that it brings to the employer (as in how much money the worker will make)?

>>15536467
No, you weren't working 40 hours a week in highschool. If you were gg on being an exceptional exception.

>>15536261
This. Only solution will be a mass global cleansing of useles people

>>15536434
High iq post

>>15538365
What you are suggesting is effectively that bank reserve requirements should be as close to 100% as possible. And I agree. But how do you realistically enforce that in a fiat based government monopoly?
Why require the public and private sector to regulate itself when you can revert to a system that cannot be cheated in the first place?
Case in point: the failed John Law system
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=diEVmQZ1QfM

>>15537415
just don't invest

>>15536261
Reading comprehension? Your point already got addressed as wrong.

>>15536628
>>15536859
>>15536872

Man, shut the fuck up and stop mass replying. Nobody here or in the world gives a fuck about anything you say.

>everything is exactly the same as it was sixty years ago
"no"

>>15536223

This is unironically true but people are too brainwashed by (((neoliberalism))) because someday they’ll be billionaires too.

Increasing minimum wage to 'liveable' status kills America's small business economy and bolster's big business/megacorps. Then demand for labor gets cut proportionately and unemployment hits record highs. After which automation replaces labor en masse.

>>15536628
I don't even have to read anything you're saying to know you're a braindead gibsmedat. You're scum. Autism walltext pathology of impotent rage.
>give me more money for no reason fuck!!!
No. No.
Fuck you.

>>15536223
Yes,but with that said, yang's proposal of ubi is a trillion times better. Raising the minimum wage would not only affect ONLY those making under the minimum wage, but it could lead to increase in the cost of prices (hurting everyone) and less job openings. More closed businesses. Less jobs.

Ubi? More buying power for EVERYONE. More disposable income for people in a local community making having a small business become realistic. Less financial straib for everyone.

Don't vote for bernie. If you want actual improvement, vote for the ONLY person paying attention to automation. Can raising the minimum wage counter-act automation? Obviously not. If anything, it could make things worse. By making it more expensive to hire people, employers that weren't automating might start to automate as it now becomes more profitable for them.

Yang is the only real solution. Everyone else will just fuck things up even more.

>>15539612
Also, less jobs = higher barrier to entry making raising the minimum wage that much worse. 1k a month is simply superior in every way.

>>15536275
Women, not even once

>>15536312
Bruh, I agree with a lot but birth control should be illegal, and condoms are like 4$, If you think "the elites" arent the ones pushing sterile loveless sex what world do you live in

>>15539569

You cut the flow of migrants first to create an environment where labour is in higher demand, and then you raise the minimum wage after that if the kike corporations won't pay up.

And if they want to move production overseas? Smash them with tariffs.

>>15536223
They think they're living in the 1950s. We don't have 2.5 billion people we have 7.5 billion people (300%) and automation. Most of you simply aren't needed. I have nothing I'd want to pay you for.

>>15536223
If you want to earn more, be more valuable.

You just want others to take care of you while you sit on your ass and play vidya games and watch amine. Like a child.

/thread

>>15536223
kys lib cucks

>>15538599
Which party just got control of the supreme court?

>>15536372
Maybe, idunno, if mcdonalds paid a livable wage then white collar workers could use this as leverage to demand higher wages as well? If their employer says nope then they can just leave and work at the local mcdonalds, which after all would be a lot less effort and probably a much shorter commune.

>>15538671
I was waiting for this answer while reading this thread, based & redpilled

>>15538599
This is why I can't buy any of this elite conspiracy bullshit. For every room temperature IQ tinfoil amerilard who thinks X is a jewish mind control conspiracy, there's another one who thinks the opposite of X is a jewish mind control conspiracy. Maybe the real answer is that everything sucks, nobody really knows what they're doing but also everyone is out to make as much money as possible at the expense of others. And the outcome is modern life, no elite cabal rqeuired.

>in b4 some schizo 'outs' me as a jewish mind control operative

>>15538671

>If the value of the labor is less than minimum wage, no one will be hired or they will be given minimal hours. If it's greater, then the person will not be paid minimum wage.

Big Mac Index homie. Wages don't have that much of an affect on prices, it's merely one component.

Hell, even the minimum wage going back to the 50s/60s/70s in real terms is much higher than it is now yet Big Macs still got made and grass still got cut.

You keep pushing the middle class and the underclass into lower and lower wages and you'll end up with a revolution on your hands.

>>15539764

>Maybe the real answer is that everything sucks, nobody really knows what they're doing but also everyone is out to make as much money as possible at the expense of others. And the outcome is modern life, no elite cabal rqeuired.

Group survival strategy vs individual. A group acting as individuals will always lose to a group exploiting this fact.

>>15539777
>you'll end up with a revolution on your hands.
Keep larping, memewarrior.

>>15536791
HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAA THAT WAS HILARIOUS BRO GG

literally just buy chainlink and work on yourself until it moons

hopefully by the time you're rich, you're ready to be rich

>>15536880
Thomas sowell extremely based

>>15539790
I can buy this, but I don't think it's a conspiracy. It's a natural consequence of industrialization and improvement of living standards that individuals start to get some breathing room and want to 'express themselves' more. There's some truth in the hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, weak men create hard times adage.

If jews retain a strong tribal identity and act in their group interest then yeah, they'll succeed while individualists flounder. It's not some special conspiracy though or some unique demonic aspect of jews, it's just social selective processes at work.

>>15539792

You're sleepwalking your way to the gallows if you think that people are going to allow themselves a lower standard of living.

I'm not even a Commie and I understand this.

>>15536223
Actually the origins of the minimum wage (at least in the US) was to ensure companies wouldn't undercut their competition by hiring ethnic minorities for a lower wage than whites.

>>15539826
>You're sleepwalking your way to the gallows if you think that people are going to allow themselves a lower standard of living.

>what are tinyhouse/van life shills
the seed has already been planted in the mass conscious

>>15536404
>The purpose of a society is to protect the weak.
Said no species that survived for millenia ever.

The weak are supposed to be removed from the gene pool. That's how any species can survive and become better over time.
If a species selects only the weak, it will shortly destroy itself entirely and become extinct.

>>15539823

>It's not some special conspiracy though or some unique demonic aspect of jews, it's just social selective processes at work.

I would agree with you it wouldn't be such a negative thing if Jews didn't ALSO heavily discourage the host population from employing the same strategy. That's the devious part of it.

The Chinese and the Indians in the USA also have a group strategy. We can see this in the elevated wages compared to the white median.

>>15539848
B-b-buh Darwinism doesn't apply anymore, that's why we have capitalism!

>>15536261
>there's too many people on this planet
Mathmatically wrong. There is enough resources for everyone on this planet to live very comfortably if the resources were distributed appropriately, and there is enough space for everyone too, so what you are saying is just a cope so you don't have to bother with a solution. Don't even @ me about MuH cOmMiEs I'm not talking about some gay teenage political ideal, I'm just saying, if we have the resources to resolve our problems then the problems are solvable. Furthermore I live in New Zealand with a population of only 6 million people yet house prices are out of most people's reach, the argument that there are just "too many people" isn't even relevant, the truth is there are not too many people on this planet, there are actually just too many people in China and India, and everywhere else is fine with the amount of people it has weighed against its resources; we are just living underneath broken social systems which few people have good ideas about how to resolve.

>>15539842

You can't raise a child in a fucking van.

If our future is mobile Hoovervilles, then count me out.

>>15536261
Truth is: that job is only viable if you have significant support from your parents (nuclear family and/or a supported minor) and/or you have a trust fund.
TL;DR, these jobs are only available because of a fucked corporate tax structure.

>>15536261

>truth is, there's too many people on this planet. too many retards out there to take care of. shitty fast food job was never supposed to be enough to support a home and family, it's supposed to be a fucking after school extra spending money job.

Plenty of Boomers never went into debt for their college tuition because they were working lower-end wage jobs on the side.

What does that say?

>>15536329
This is not a wrong answer. I want a digital President. AI should not be seen as an adversary, but if handled honestly the society with the best AI should have the most fair life. Why don’t we have AI in massively executive funtions? Because we would have massive redistribution of wealth. That’s not to say everyone gets a piece of the pie. But the world would look a lot different if intelligent, fair decisions were made.
t. someone who is in the government contract market

The minimum wage was established to elevate low skill natives over immigrants. Nativism at its finest, but lets just pretend otherwise.

>>15539953
It says college tuition underwent massive inflation, an entire generation was sold into getting a degree, demand and government gibs drove the creation of an entire industry of debt, and the fed promoted massive inflation to the point where household income could never catch up to the growing rate of wealth inequality. You're also retarded for suggesting that is even remotely similar to now.

>>15539826
How low can you go? People are already living in matchboxes and living off ramen with zero in their account at the end of the month. Silicon Valley is full of working homeless living in tents, how could the standard of living get any worse?

>>15536312
Aren't condoms free in your country? I live in México, and condoms are free at any public hospital; you just walk in and they hand you some 50 or 70 if you ask for them. Low IQ people don't use them anyway.

>>15539918
Completely retarded fucking response. The reason why the distribution is shit is because central banking has allowed people who genetically have NO ECONOMIC VALUE to reproduce like rats

Here’s where your logical thinking goes: oh we have plenty of resources, so why not just allow everyone to do what they want? Including allow Tyrone to knock up a dozen teenagers, and for their kids to do the same...reproduce like rats in a sewer funding their lives through stealing and selling water bottles on the street

This logic will continue until we have a population of 20 billion globally, 19 billion of whom are completely useless and only know how to shit piss eat sleep and fuck. And then we will have a global extinction of event the likes of which the world will ever seen.

The sooner the mass culling begins, the more likely the planet survives it

>>15540082
By that time people would have colonized mars and Earth will devolve into Planet of the Apes.

>>15540041

You're retarded for thinking it is solely a governmental phenomena. Business had it's role in bringing about the current state of the system too.

>>15540045

The cheap trinkets from Asia could get cut off. That could make it worse in the short term.

It's funny that the nation that has the greatest capacity for autocracy is so reliant upon outside manufacturing.

>>15540099
>It's funny that the nation that has the greatest capacity for autocracy is so reliant upon outside manufacturing.

I'd say this was always China's long-term plan. Tbh it's pretty cool to watch it unfold.

>>15539918
>Several estimates of the carrying capacity have been made with a wide range of population numbers. A 2001 UN report said that two-thirds of the estimates fall in the range of 4 billion to 16 billion with unspecified standard errors, with a median of about 10 billion.[5]More recent estimates are much lower, particularly ifnon-renewable resource depletionandincreased consumptionare considered.[6][7]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrying_capacity#Humans

Also lmaoing at
>I'm just saying, if we have the resources to resolve our problems then the problems are solvable.
That shit is deep lol. You ever thought of a career in politics?

>>15536223
And then one day, for no reason at all, the tradeable sector all fucked off to Mexico and China and shit.

>>15536223
Keep in mind that this was at a time where w*men didn't work. The rightful conclusion here is that w*men ruin everything.

>>15540109

The Americans did it to themselves though. What did they think would happen if they exported their manufacturing capacity to an enemy nation?

>>15540193
>Enemy
Great excuse to have a war.

>>15536485
>An increase in the availability of labour also proportionally increases the internal market, creating more jobs to meet demand.

That's only really true (and of neutral effect) if the people being added are stratified across economic domains to the same extent as the native population. Adding 50 million ordinary Japanese people to Japan would simply make the economy nominally larger. Adding 50 million Japanese janitors is another situation altogether.

>>15540082
>Here’s where your logical thinking goes:
Nah I'm not saying any of that but cool strawman bro.

>>15540137
>That shit is deep lol.
Really I thought it was about as simple and obvious as I could've stated it.

Your gay fucking wikipedia article is as stupid as you are. "Overpopulation" is a liberal meme created by jews and pushed by white liberals to justify white genocide and mass murder of improverished populations created by the jewish banking system. Straight up. The quote you have presented me with is based on hypotheses made by far left academia, look at those fucking authors, Jesus Christ. You are not equipped to discuss fucking anything let alone the fate of the fucking planet, you are bound by limiting belief systems and political bias, and on top of that, seem to just believe whatever the fuck you're told. It's okay guys, I got the quote from wikipedia. Give me a break.

If we moved away from a currency based economy and moved towards a resource based economy literally the entire planet and everyone on it would be saved. You know scarcity is artificially enforced by our banking system and doesn't need to exist, and also that because of the poverty created by enforced scarcity you get improverished communities whose populations explodes out of control. None of that needs to happen. We need to find a better way.

>>15536624

In the 113 years before the Fed, the US dollar increased in value by 50%. In the 100 years that followed, it decreased in value over 95%.

>>15540202

If war was the intention, I would have thought they'd do it when they still had overwhelming manufacturing capacity.

If those carriers go to the bottom of the Pacific, America's status as an invincible military power goes with them.

>>15540243
You do realize whites are the real jews and the jews now are just super jews. I thought this shit was fucking obvious.
T W E L V E (12) FUCKING TRIBES

>>15540256
This suddenly feels applicable

>>15536960
>Do you really believe money should increase in value over time? Sounds like a great way for the economy to stagnate

Wrong, just look at the history of the US between 1800 and 1913. But you shouldn't need to know history to know your point makes no sense. If money is increasing in value, people will mostly buy just what they need, which is good.

>>15540261
>You do realize whites are the real jews

>>15540284
My man buttmad about the TRUTH. Can't even handle the fire, the woke FLAME.

>>15540269

That seems as if Americans are incompetent militarily and only got by through their massive material advantage.

>>15540328
Beats me, we're sure living in interesting times though.

>>15536223
That's because you don't know shit, OP.

Minimum wage was NOT introduced under that premise, it's absolute fucking bullshit. Actually grab a history book and read on how and why it was introduced, and, you'll find that's good old American racism.

You see one the slaves where freed they slowly made their ways to the northen states, specially Detroit manufacturing, and they were willing to take cheaper wages for similar work the white man was doing. White man said fuck that and passed a MINIMUM wage to prevent the blacks from taking their jobs. Business owners seeing that they could no longer hire cheap black labor, was forced to pay a minimum wage regardless of race, they of course chose to hire white rather than black.

And that's how that happen.
don't believe the lefts bullish to social justice minimum wage none sense. What I write is the truth. Deal with it.

>>15536275

And it also leads to inflated house prices because now the average homeowner is a dual income family where before it was all single income. So now a person who is single has to compete with all the dual income couples to buy houses that are in limited supply, so basically it becomes impossible for a single person to buy a house unless you make 2x what the average professional is earning. I live in an area saturated with dual six figure income families which causes anyone making less than 200k struggle to afford a single family house. Shit is fucked.

I *should* be a billionaire with 10 yachts.
Your arbitrary, and unsubstantial opinion on how things should be is not how sustainable governments are run.

The immutable laws of supply and demand determine what minimum wage affords. The supply of low wage workers has increased by nearly 50 million mexicans, many of whom contribute to a $135 billion deficit in welfare costs
>muh i cant afford lunch, so the school will pay for it
>free college for illegals
>free healthcare for illegals
>they can't afford hospital bill, so hospitals charge insurance, and insurance spreads the cost to everyone else
>can't pay insurance, so other insurance payers pay the cost when they crash
>50 million more people competing for houses, rent costs increase by 50%
>mexicans don't know how to drive and always are killing and crashing
>many of their wages are paid under the table, and are not taxed

and yet all these dumb leftists are the first to clamor that we need another 100 million mexicans and to kill all white people. every leftist city has already has a higher minimum wage and it didn't make anything more affordable. a fast food meal in a rural area is $4, in los angeles the same meal is $12. that's what a $14.25 minimum wage does to prices. There is no free lunch.

literally all the family owned small businesses here hire mexicans. the 20 somethings and fathers run it but they hire mexicans. for example good luck getting into roofing.

>>15540767
boomers dont care. theyre not paying for it. yound people dont understand. white middle age pay for it and old theyre the bad guy.

>>15536223
Problem is that women being in the workforce puts the number of consumers almost equal to the number of producers.

>>15536624
>learn economics bro
>dollar down 90% from ATH
your system has failed
cantillion effect on full power

>>15536624
>>15536791
>>15536848
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>>15538365
>35 posts by this ID
LMAO FED FAGGOT YOUR DAMAGE CONTROL IS FUCKING OVER, KEEP DOWNLOADING MORE REACTION IMAGES, IT'S TOTALLY WORKING LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
DOLLAR DEAD IN 2020 YOU FUCKING KIKE

>>15536275
Exactly. When you paid someone a wage they were going to serve a purpose to society. Only a very small number of bachelors and "bachelors" and an even smaller number of celibate clergy were not a part of this system wherein they paid back into society by creating new people. Nowadays there's no inherent connection between wage-earning and reproduction because thanks to contraception and the promotion of homosexuality and other hedonisms there's no inherent connection between sexuality and reproduction.
The reason most things are so fucked up, both in the culture and demographics of the first world and the quality of life in the third world is that the elites have figured out that outsourcing reproduction to certain countries and consumption to other countries is more profitable in the immediate term. It's a gamble against the sustainability of that system whether it works in the long run.

>>15537449
Why the FUCK are you so angry? END YOURSELF AND LEAVE GOOD PEOPLE ALONE.

>>15541610
dollar has to inflate to support more people. no one uses bitcoin to buy things because its deflationary and volatile.
gallon of milk cost has increased by 5.7x while wages increased 10x. seems like the system is working pretty well

>>15541631
..is this what a slide looks like? I've never actually seen one. glows in the dark.

guess that confirms it, we have glowniggers amongst us

>>15536223
truth

>>15536261
>after school
Nice work hours there. A fastfood bussinesses that barely stays open during work hours - great idea.