/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>11979993
>why should I give a fuck?

Privacy isn’t an emergent property you fuckwad. You need a ground up solution

>>11979993
? meaning?

>>11980026
meaning you dont need XMR anymore you can just use the eth network

>>11980043
I think ETH sucks I dn't want to use it.

>>11979993
You're missing the second most important aspect of privacy currencies: liquidity. For a currency to be an effective store of value wealthy people and orgs need to be able to buy and sell large quantities without moving the market. In a world where all privacy tech is equal, the one to be adopted first will dominate due to liquidity. In our world, that's xmr.

Plus I doubt that zk proofs on eth is as good as ringct + stealth address + all the other goodies xmr has.

>>11979993
>>11980043

you wish OP, we like our independence.

>>11979993
Eth's only* ever accomplishment is emulating a real crypto good chat thanks OP
*aside from Cryptokitties

>>11979993
These are private amounts, the transaction origin is not anonymous. This allows mixing so basically equal to monero, but zcash is still much better.
It's only temporary, zcash is going to arrive on ethereum

>>11979993
link?

how is a non-anonymous chain going to host anonymous crypto, this is all being done on an ETH network.

listen nerds, can i check your eth balance? yes i can - WOW SO PRIVATE OMG SELL ALL XMR

>>11980438
https://www.trustnodes.com/2018/12/01/zcash-and-monero-have-been-turned-into-an-ethereum-smart-contract-zero-knowledge-proofs-are-now-just-a-dapp

>>11979993
smart contracts finna delete the ethereum network some day aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa rrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

>>11980483
remember that meme where you could put eth into an EOS smart contract?

>non private ledger
>dapp emulating privacy
AHAHAHAHAHAHA

>turing completeness is overkill
>turing completeness is overkill
>turing completeness is overkill
>turing completeness is overkill
>turing completeness is overkill

>>11980775
Actually whats the problem here?
I see zero reason why a dapp cannot be used for privacy. Dapps are better for privacy as well because more people hold the coin and thus its harder to know wo is using the dapp and for what reasons.

feature-coins have no long term future. that goes for privacy coins, but any simple value token, like dash, nano, litecoin. right now they have niche use, but none of them will ever get to the point of real adoption before equivalents appear on first/second layers on blockchains people actually use like bitcoin or ethereum.

this is one of the reasons you can actually be bullish about the future of crypto, because it means fewer coins with very high valuations skewing the market cap/perception and allowing for growth that isn't possible when you have nearly 15 coins supposedly worth over a billion dollars.

>>11980065
yes, liquidity, the kind of liquidity you get by being a slave token on top of a blockchain everybody already has a wallet to, or owns tokens of, like ethereum.

monero has relatively small volume compared to coins around it precisely because it is a difficult coin to use securely, and doesn't have many speculators because of it, only users that need privacy today.

>>11980444
the same way monero finds use being a minority chain outside of the bitcoin ecosystem. when you create a closed system of services or merchants that accept a privacy token, or second layer token on top of bitcoin or ethereum, you have a closed loop exactly the same as monero.

there is no difference between having a second layer with monero privacy on a public network where transactions stay entirely within this private layer. its only an issue when you try to exit from this private layer, just like its only an issue when you try to exit from monero.

>>11980043
0xXMR?

atmos

>>11980065
>ringct + stealth address
you can do all those things in a smart contract

ringct is just pedersen commitments with range proofs
stealth address is just diffie-hellman key exchange

the hardest part is probably porting the bulletproofs to solidity but thats it. the only reason this wasnt done before was because the elliptic curve/scalar multiplications gas costs were very expensive. but they have been improved now so it only costs 800k gas to do (or $0.25).

Zcash will be the only viable privacy coin in the future. All other protocols are doomed.

Eth is dead

>>11981015
Not if it goes POS. If that happens then ETh is far from dead.

>>11981034
Do you think Eth will implement avalanche?
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXrrqtFlGow

>>11981003
>>11980891

Monero is private by default

no other coin is like that, you can't beat private by default.

>>11981104
>no other coin is like that, you can't beat private by default.

a Dapp that is private by default is just as good if not better. The biggest problem with coins like monero is that all anyone has to do is see if you have ever purchased some. Entering and exiting those coins tends to be pretty obvious.

With a dapp then anyone who is holding the coin can be airdropped tokens thus causing everyone on the network to automatically have some of the coin. From there all you need to do is make the dapp as secure as possible and now its pretty much impossible to know who did or did not enter or exit the privacy functionality.

>>11981185
It's as possible as knowing everyone got some Mr. Bigbrain.

>>11981200
The act of purchasing Monero is a red flag that can be checked up on by the IRS or the CIA. What does this person intend to hide?

But if everyone who is holding ETH suddenly gets an airdrop of privacy tokens then there is no intention. It muddles things a lot.

>>11981003
>he doesnt know about cloak

>>11981216
https://chainz.cryptoid.info/cloak/#!rich

You're going to get arrested faggot.

>>11981104
What matters is number of users.
Anonymity = you're one of all possible users.
If optional anonymity has more users than default (in another network) it's more anonymous.

>>11979993
HAHAHAHAHAHA
This is how ETH finally dies off. No chance the powers that be are going to allow a privacy coin to be used in the real economy. Govs need transparency. ETH is now a #criminalcoin in their eyes.

>>11981521

Yes, without taking into account external information from 'clever attacks', Monero's ring signatures are 'true privacy' in a mathematical sense. And there have been similar (if arguably more effective in practice) clever attacks introduced against Zcash. There is actually relatively little real difference between the two in this sense, but I wouldn't expect /biz/ trolls to understand

>>11981647
>literally pyramid scheme running on ETH
it's okay
>some people develop prototype of private dapp
we must ban this currency

>>11981662
>Monero's ring signatures are 'true privacy' in a mathematical sense
No they aren't, the set of anonymity is very small. When you send monero to someone, that someone's anonymity depends on how many other people take his output as a mixin.
You can expect like 3 in a few days.
Zcash's anonymity includes everyone who ever sent anything to a shielded address.

>>11981034

Woah, this means that it's possible to cloak 0xBTC

>>11980842
Monero isn't bitcoin with a privacy "feature" added. Monero is what bitcoin was supposed to be. It solves bitcoins fundamental problems with scaling and fungibility. The problems are so fundamental to bitcoin that they can't be fixed by adding a feature.

>>11979993
Now we are going to have to hear about 0xXMR and 0xZEC for the next year,

>>11982107
>>11982013
>>11981104
>>11980891
I've been out of the game for so long, but darkcoin and monero always was meant to be strong, are we staying or swaying with a new crypto in the making ?

>>11980003
hashing is the ground and eth can do it in dapps.

someone just needed to code it in, which they now have done :))

expect big movement

>>11982013
Monero has worse problems than bitcoin with scaling.

If anything monero adds to bitcoins fungibility, you can just swap your bitcoin for monero and then back to bitcoin.

>>11980434
>basically equal to monero

monero does mixing (hides the amounts/makes them indistinguishable from it's neighbors) AND hides the receiving and sending addresses

>>11980873
doesn't bitcoins lightning network basically do the same thing?

>>11982295
can we please have a modified version of this image

>>11982245
Wrong and wrong. Monero has a flexible block size limit that is impossible for Bitcoin to implement. And you need to check the dictionary for fungibility because it looks like you've mistaken its meaning.

>>11982318
Thank you comfy Riccardo!!

>>11979993
DAPS is better.

>>11980891
>>11981104
>old blockchain with privacy integrated
vs
>non-private blockchain with solidity functions that pretend to emulate privacy

Nah, real privacy is DAPS


and not gay like both of you