/biz/ - Business & Finance

>investing in anything but the big three

>>10794191
>three
theres only two, btc+eth, and even eth is arguable to this point. but if your end goal is accumulating cryptocurrency, you are only interested in accumulating more btc or eth, never anything else.

>>10794191
Besides Link, what are the other two?

>>10794172

> Hates permissionless innovation
> Loves needing permissions from ((them))

>>10794226
Replace ETH with EOS, and add XLM in there. ETH is a useless shitcoin and will remain a shitcoin until they actually implement scaling.

>>10794226
MONERO > ETH

Even Vitalik admitted

>>10794251
>XLM
*XMR. XLM is also a shitcoin.

>>10794226
Monero > ETH

Even vitalik admitted his shitcoin factory could drop back to 10$

>>10794251
not really interested in the opinions of late adopters

>>10794252
monero is fine to use but is a bad investment because you're betting on btc+eth never improving privacy long term.

>>10794278
your inability too move with the technology will be your downfall. I've been around since the first couple of BTC bull runs. BTC is a shitcoin, but it will remain relevant because of first mover advantage and the fact that it still does its job relatively well regardless of being a shitcoin. Ethereum doesn't have those advantages. Its success is entirely contingent on being a good platform, which it is not.

>>10794278
>public ledger
>privacy

>>10794315

Everyone is using eth. Of course they will have competitors. So did Java but it's still everywhere.

>>10794334
>Comparing Ethereum to Java
What did he mean by this? Java is turing complete. It can do anything any other programming language can do, and at reasonable speeds. Ethereum literally cannot do simple things like real-time gambling games.

>>10794349

As a boomer java frikkin barely worked in the day. It was that or C/C++. The abstractions were better though, like solidity vs btc.
Now you can choose between 100 different languages but java is still a king because of the jvm and developer community.
Fuck I'm old.

>>10794378
Now think of all those other shit languages that were popular in the 80s and 90s and never survived. Ethereum is the BASIC/AOL/Yahoo! of crypto.

>>10794434

Bad analogy, and wtf do companies have to do with anything.

Every innovative language that was good back then is better and more used today.

>>10794479
>Bad analogy, and wtf do companies have to do with anything.
They had first mover advantage, but were shit products and so they were replaced by something better. Ethereum is currently in the position of AOL circa 2000.

>Every innovative language that was good back then is better and more used today.
I don't see anyone using LISP today.

>>10794191
>>10794226
There's only two and that's BTC and BCH as a hedge/PnD bag.

>>10794499

Clojure, HOLO, various startups. LISP is alive and well and a great example of what I said. There are popular-enough implementations on nearly every platform.

Eth != aol... not even sure where to start with that one.

>>10794499
Ethereum is literally the only functioning smart contract platform.
EOS DPOS is already a shitshow. They couldnt pretend to be decentralised for even a month. There is no doubt high value contracts would be at risk of interference.
NEO obviously a tech shitshow.
ARK, LISK, NULS, ADA, TRON, VECHAIN, IOTA.... come on.
I'll put it like this, if you had a billion dollar contract that you knew was going to be attacked, which chain would you put it on?

>>10794571
EOS already has real time gambling games and real time DEXes that work flawlessly. It's functioning the way Ethereum was supposed to function. I don't really care about your opinion on muh decentralization and muh BPs. Usability > ideology.

>>10794599
>usability > security
Yeah thats not how money works

>>10794626
Actually it is. That's why the vast majority of normies don't use crypto yet. The security is way too inconvenient. Besides, Ethereum is majority controlled by three Chinese mining pools. That's not security.

>>10794639
>Security isn't important
You realise that's the whole point of this shit?
If you don't care about security (and by extension trustlessness) then just use a fucking server you absolute brainlet.

>>10794690
Did I say security isn't important? The point is that there's a sweet spot between security and usability. Absolute security is both extremely inconvenient, and unnecessary for the vast majority of people. That's why we don't all wear helmets while driving bullet proof cars armed with semi-automatic weapons.

>>10794738
Absolute security is impossible. And there is no "sweet spot", there are trade-offs which should be balanced according to application.
EOS balances those trade-offs badly. Its performance is far worse than a centralised server, and it may in fact be even LESS secure than one, as a server will have a single legally-liable entity running it, rather than EOS's small group of probably colluding actors from different jurisdictions.

>>10794795
>EOS balances those trade-offs badly. Its performance is far worse than a centralised server
Go play a few rounds at http://dice.eosbet.io and say that again.

>and it may in fact be even LESS secure than one, as a server will have a single legally-liable entity running it, rather than EOS's small group of probably colluding actors from different jurisdictions.
This just goes to show that you don't understand what you're talking about. The fact that it's spread throughout different jurisdictions means that there is no possible way for any particular jurisdiction to impose its laws on the blockchain. Even if single BP's get shut down, they will just be replaced immediately with no down time.

>>10794795
>EOS balances those trade-offs badly. Its performance is far worse than a centralised server, and it may in fact be even LESS secure than one, as a server will have a single legally-liable entity running it, rather than EOS's small group of probably colluding actors from different jurisdictions.

Bullshit, part of EOS security is that Alex Jones can talk about his gay frogs without being banned. Part of the security is that no one entity can freeze your account. Part of the security is that its using modernized tech where the devs dont hold 100% of the power.

EOS is positioned as the best possible combination. And shut the fuck up about

> muh Ethereum
> muh 100% decentralization

Because if ETH doesn't adopt the exact same fucking systems as EOS the most it will ever be is a child porn suppository and FBI honeypot. No mass adoption, no future, no moon missions. Nobody will fucking use that shit.

As time goes on all dapps coins are going to pretty much follow in EOS footsteps solving the same problems EOS already fucking solves in some form or fashion. So either get with the times and understand the topic or slam into the child porn wall that zero censorship is going to get you and carry the heaviest fucking bags ever until the day you die.

>>10794829
10% of EOS addresses control the voting. Not even "entities". Literal addresses.
https://www.trustnodes.com/2018/06/03/just-10-addresses-hold-nearly-50-eos-tokens
If you're renting a server rack there are probably more than 10 people who have oversight. EOS has 0 decentralisation.
>>10794873
>Part of the security is that no one entity can freeze your account
Wut. They freeze accounts all the time. And not only that, but they fuck up while doing it.

>>10794999
Sorry, not 10%. 10. Just 10. The number 10.

>>10794999
>Wut. They freeze accounts all the time. And not only that, but they fuck up while doing it.

Bullshit, they need a consensus of 18-21 people. Explain to me how that is

> suddenly google

when google can fuck it do it when one intern shows up for work that day and doesnt like the shirt you had on in the latest video.

You want to prove me wrong? Go get banned for posting some controversial on steemit. Let know how that works out for you.

>>10794999
> EOS has 0 decentralisation

EOS is the absolute most decentralized dapps platform you are going to get that will also hold value.

The best ETH will be able to do is produce a bunch of dapps where the devs have 100% control over everything and its literally identical to google facebook twitter ect.

Because someone is going to have to censor shit or the platform will not gain mass adoption. Someone has to have the power to remove bad and illegal shit. A democratic or even plutocratic solution is as good as you can get. Otherwise you end up right back at fucking square one again.

>>10794999
>>10794999
>10% of EOS addresses control the voting.
That's not true. Most of those top 10 are exchanges that don't vote, and the biggest one is b1 which isn't voting at all. This is all transparent so I'm not sure why you'd make shit up like this. See: http://eos-bp-votes.dapptools.info/s/api/block-producer-votes-stack-html/1/70

>>10795109
>This is all transparent so I'm not sure why you'd make shit up like this.

People are upset that ETH is just a incomplete shittier more centralized (in practice) version of EOS. They dont understand that pure currency coins are a different ball game than dapps platforms.

If you want max decentralization then you should stick with pure currency coins where there is no need for governance.

>>10795032
>>10795100
>Bullshit, they need a consensus of 18-21 people
https://www.coindesk.com/eos-blockchain-arbitrator-orders-freeze-of-27-accounts/
Sit down.
>>10795109
You're right, 10% of addresses don't control EOS voting.
10 addresses do.
10 individuals (or less!) control 50% of the tokens, and therefor the entire vote by definition.
http://www.coinfox.info/news/9639-analysis-10-addresses-control-50-of-eos-tokens

>>10795242
Why don't you click on that link I sent you instead of repeating the same bullshit that I just debunked?

>>10795269
You didn't debunk shit. You linked some barcharts that show bitfinex as the overwhelming voter. You can see their votes from fucking space lol.
Why would you link a chart that contradicts your point? Are you hoping no one will click it?

>>10795242
>Sit down.

Yeah I said what I said while knowing about that shit that happened months ago. LOL You fucking desperate idiot.

What I said stands.

ETH bag holding is an act of pure desperation.

WHAT HAPPENED TO MY NEM AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>10795109
>>10795269
>the biggest one is b1 which isn't voting at all
Get the fuck out of here you fucking liar
https://cointelegraph.com/news/eos-creator-block-one-to-vote-for-network-s-block-producers-as-community-member

>>10795283
Bitfinex allows its holders to vote you fucking brainlet.

>>10795304
https://bloks.io/account/b1
Click the "voter info" tab. Goddamn you people are stupid.

>>10795283
>You didn't debunk shit.

I just laughed at your garbage argument.

> https://www.coindesk.com/eos-blockchain-arbitrator-orders-freeze-of-27-accounts/
> Sit down.

Wait is that the one where it didn't go through because one of the people failed to vote?

You do realize ETH is doing this worse too once it gets further in development right? Whats your angle here? you want to throw smoke screen at this point. You want to pretend ETHs not just going to end up doing the same shit in the end anyway.

> Get the fuck out of here you fucking liar

You are the delusional one if you think ETH is going to be a bastion of 100% decentrality and also be able to have larger scale dapps. Pick one man.

>>10795314
https://block.one/news/block-ones-participation-as-voting-eos-community-member/
>Block.one will soon begin allocating votes to block producers
I guess you dgaf you'll just claim any random shit and post a bunch of unrelated graphs hoping no one will notice.
Standard shill tactic.

>>10795348
I said that b1 hasn't voted yet, and that is a provably correct statement. You're embarrassing yourself. And there's nothing wrong if they do vote. It's their money, their project, and they should do what they feel is in the community's best interests.

>>10795340
>EOS freezes 7 accounts in violation of its own ‘constitution’
https://thenextweb.com/hardfork/2018/06/19/eos-cryptocurrency-constitution/
They just love freezing accounts. A lot of the time they don't even give reasons.

>>10795348
> Standard shill tactic.

Looks like projection to me mother fucker. Your the one desperate as fuck. You linked me

> https://www.coindesk.com/eos-blockchain-arbitrator-orders-freeze-of-27-accounts/

in response to when I said

> Bullshit, they need a consensus of 18-21 people

Which is what they need to do that kind of shit and is also something that is needed for more complex dapps platforms anyway otherwise you run into massive problems with either the devs being 100% unchecked authoritarians or zero censorship producing useless platform nobody will ever adopt.

So which is it shilly man. buddy boy?

>>10795348

wow, he said they weren't voting at all and they haven't voted at all. and we'll all be better off if they ever decide to do so

>>10795376
>They just love freezing accounts. A lot of the time they don't even give reasons.

Lie
So that must mean they froze accounts this month? You seem great at finding articles. So let us know if they froze an account recently. This month?

Anything? How about last month? Nothing.. hmm

kek

>>10795364
>I said that b1 hasn't voted yet
Actually you said
>b1 which isn't voting at all.
On which you were proven to be a liar, and then you tried to weasel out of it.
Good thing we have a record, huh?
I understand, staying consistent with your lies can be difficult when English isn't your first language and you're typing out of a shill farm in Russia :)

>>10795430

I noticed you are ignoring my point because it utterly fucks you up.

> Which is what they need to do that kind of shit and is also something that is needed for more complex dapps platforms anyway otherwise you run into massive problems with either the devs being 100% unchecked authoritarians or zero censorship producing useless platform nobody will ever adopt.

Just putting that out there. ETH will end up being a worse version of EOS in practice anyway so its pointless to continue.

>>10795444
I'm ignoring your "point" because I caught you in a lie and I would prefer people to see that than to let you slide the thread.
Is that ok?

>>10795430
Seems like you lack reading comprehension skills ranjeesh. Not voting != will never vote.

What if I told you that if btc won’t be able to make a new ATH in 2018 that it will be replaced by other trading pairs, maybe XRP or ETH?

>>10795491

>>10795444
We can sit here and argue the details and whine and yell and bicker. But in the end EOS is ahead of ETH and ETH will ultimately follow anyway. Its just a reality. Its the nature of the beast.

ETH will be doing all the same shit. ANd it would be better if it did anyway because the kind of setup EOS has is superior anyway. So Vitalik will setup some system to freeze accounts and prevent 51% attacks with some kind of nodes. "Whatch the entire network for bad actors ect"

>>10795468
>I'm ignoring your "point" because I caught you in a lie and I would prefer people to see that than to let you slide the thread.
>Is that ok?


> I'm ignoring your "point" because I caught you in a lie and I would prefer people to see that than to let you slide the thread.
Is that ok?

You havent caught me lieing at all. I have been butt fucking you hard. The best you came up with was an article which said exactly what I said.

You reinforced my fucking point with your weak ass argument.

>>10795504
>But in the end EOS is ahead of ETH
ETH has higher mcap, more devs (way more), more security and more applications.
EOS claims to have the same number of tps as TRON, so congrats on that I guess, maybe some day you'll use them for something other than spam.

> ETH has higher mcap, more devs (way more), more security and more applications.

I am talking about the technology and the flow of logic.

The ONLY reason why EOS stands out right now so much is because it is the only dapps platform in visible space that is setup to actually house complex social media dapps.

The moment ETH starts getting that kind of functionality is the moment they have to solve the same problems and suddenly ALL dapps coins start looking like different versions of fucking EOS. Because EOS shows that if you do it any other way you run into serious problems.

Thus you need some kind of on chain governance.

> EOS claims to have the same number of tps as TRON, so congrats on that I guess, maybe some day you'll use them for something other than spam.

You also need high tps to be good dapps platform. Guess what, ETH is going to have higher tps too! And as soon as it gets higher tps.

> Oh wait we need some kind of way to deal with bad actors!
> Should the dapps devs have 100% of the power? I thought ETH was meant to be decentralized.

And ETH slowly transforms into fucking EOS in the first place. Its not complex. TRX will do it too, if its not already. NEO too.

All dapps coins are going to be doing this shit.

>>10795590
Your entire argument is premised on the fact that Ethereum has had 3 year head start. Laughable.

>higher mcap
not for long

>more devs
not for long

>more security
Nope. Chinese mining pools != security. Also lol hardforks

>more applications
not for long

You're basically comparing facebook to myspace in 2004. The writing is on the wall.

>EOS claims to have the same number of tps as TRON
EOS holds the record for most TPS on any blockchain with about 4,000.

>maybe some day you'll use them for something other than spam.
One single gambling app on EOS is doing nearly as many transactions per day as the entire Ethereum blockchain right now.

>>10795646
>Your entire argument is premised on the fact that Ethereum has had 3 year head start.
Correct.
ETH isn't myspace, it's microsoft.
Faggot fanboys of other shit platforms will spend the next decade complaining and getting rekt.

i have 290,000 dogecoins

The only fucking reason ETH looks like its super decentralized compared to EOS NEO TRX ect is because it doesn't fucking work yet. Its not finished.

So when I fucking see people use the "EOS IS NOT DECETRALIZED" its fucking irritating as hell. Its myopic garbage argument where it only works on anyone who cant think 2-3 steps ahead to realize that all dapps coins are going to have to solve the same problems somehow anyway thus they will all end up being very similar.

Think about what it would be like if ETH got a fully scaled Facebook dapp tomorrow. It would be a fucking disaster. The bad press alone would probably stain crypto for half a decade.

> ETH isn't myspace, it's microsoft.

Microsoft has mass adoption though. :)

>>10795748
Microsoft had a competent CEO who understood how to get mass adoption, and how to work the market. Vitalik is literally too autistic to care about anything other than the technology and ideology, and for that reason Ethereum will fail. Ethereum is AOL, not Microsoft.

>>10795774
Yeah work on scalability first, security will just sort itself out or something kek. Great plan.
>>10795781
>Vitalik is literally too autistic to care about anything other than the technology and ideology
Sounds like a perfect lead dev, which he is. He's not a CEO, but you wouldn't know that.
It's a good thing Ethereum has an entire ecosystem of bizdev people around it to do that shit.
But who needs JP Morgan, Intel and Microsoft when you have .... eos knights.....

>>10795863
It's irrelevant. Ethereum is built on a shit foundation and will never be able to keep up with newer technology no matter how great its "bizdev" people are. The fact of the matter is that no one will use DEXes and games that require transaction fees and 10 minute long transaction wait times when they can use instant and feeless alternatives.

>>10795863
>Yeah work on scalability first, security will just sort itself out or something kek. Great plan.

Your the one arguing for a 100% centralized system where the dapps devs have full power over the entire eco system. I mean thats one way to solve it!

Its not decentralized though. Actually, it kind of reminds me of current gen social media.

> Sounds like a perfect lead dev

Sounds like you are living in delusional land. And like I said, its a fucking certainty he is going to provide on chain governance. Hes already talked about it through the use of observer nodes.

So I dont even know what you are arguing anymore. Buying EOS now is like buying ETH in 3 years.

>>10795922
>It's irrelevant.
>Having massive coorperations working on your platform is irrelevat
Absolute delusion.

TPS is trivial. TPS at scale with security is hard.
Congrats, you did the easy part.

>>10795968
>TPS is trivial. TPS at scale with security is hard.

This argument is shit. You cannot have a complex daps platform without a way to deal with random garbage. Bugs, bad actors ect...

SO ETH is junk until it gets that functionality.

>>10796011
> You cannot have a complex daps platform without a way to deal with random garbage.
Maybe try not coding random garbage in the first place.
https://cryptovest.com/news/security-firm-finds-critical-bugs-in-eos-code-mainnet-launch-may-be-delayed/

This is why it takes years to create a platform.

>>10795968
Security is not a binary. We've already gone through this. Certain apps will require certain varying degrees of security. EOS will fulfill most people's security needs. And Ethereum is less secure than EOS to begin with, so I don't know why you're so fixated on this one particular aspect.

>>10796047
>Maybe try not coding random garbage in the first place.
Confirmed for not a developer. Goddamn you're dumb. Not even NASA with millions of dollars going towards peer review is capable of writing code that doesn't occasionally kill a person.

>>10796047
>Maybe try not coding random garbage in the first place.

Your the one who got rekt by the my points and you are like a zombie still posting. You don't get these articles and you don't refute anything. That's a major problem if this is the best you can do.

> ETH is going to end up doing everything EOS does in almost exactly the same ways. SInce ETH is unfinished you can pretend its not the case.

So you going to throw down some actual discussion? Or you going to be rekt by this point.

>>10796047
>This is why it takes years to create a platform.

Kind of like how ETH will take until 2020 to duplicate all of EOS features.

>>10796076
>Not even NASA with millions of dollars going towards peer review is capable of writing code that doesn't occasionally kill a person.
NASA code has never caused a fatality, all their failures were hardware or human error.
You just can't stop being wrong.

>>10796132
>You just can't stop being wrong.

Its a good thing that ETHs core dev team will be able to copy EOS directly to make their lives easier. 2022 when they finally get something in place that works just like EOS.

It will be great!

Notice hes not responding to me. glazes over this fact and keeps going, talking about NASA or some shit.

>>10794251

>>10794271
>>10794252


Monero is shit, Monero < ZCASH < KMD

>>10796132
>NASA code has never caused a fatality, all their failures were hardware or human error.
Wrong. Buggy software kills people all the time. https://royal.pingdom.com/2009/03/19/10-historical-software-bugs-with-extreme-consequences/

>>10794172
I don't care if my alt goes to 0. I'm not fucking selling. I missed out on making $1 million dollars because I sold a coin after holding for only 2 months. 4 months later, it shot through the roof. And it was a high volume coin on several T1 exchanges, so I could've cashed out with minimal slippage.

>decentralization
>scalability
>security
pick 2 retards

>>10796407
Again, this argument does not apply to dapps coins the same it applies to currency coins.

With dapps coins you have to do things a specific way or the all of it goes out the window anyway. So the pick two thing is pointless. Obviously you need scalabity or it can run the dapp. Obviously it has to be more decentralized than google or there is no point. Obvious it needs to be secure or it will never be useful.

This shit makes zero fucking sense to say in the context of dapps platforms. THEY NEED ALL FUCKING 3.

>>10796487
>they need
but they fucking can't, therefore pick 2 retard

>>10796767
>>10796407
None of those are binary. It's just a matter of balance.

>>10796198
>One of the subcontractors NASA used
Yeah try again sweetie
>>10796487
Ethereum created the last bullrun. EOS is just one more shittoken that benefited from that.
Block one doesn't even have any legal duties for the billions they collected. They can spend it all on coke right now and there isn't a thing you can do about it.

>>10796964
Educate yourself retard. Writing complex code that's bug free is impossible. Why would anyone even want that? https://gizmodo.com/the-typo-that-destroyed-a-nasa-rocket-1596004226

>>10797021
>Writing complex code that's bug free is impossible
Yes that does seem to be the EOS position kek

>>10797057
that's the position of anyone who's ever written software before. and that's why your shitcoin Ethereum had to hard fork.

>>10797090
Ethereum has never been hacked. EOS almost hacked itself before it was even launched lmao.
Dan Larimer is the Roger Ver of blockchain devlopment, a brainlet who dunning krugered his way to the top thanks to shady backers.

>>10797111
>Ethereum has never been hacked.
Which is why the hard fork happened...?

> EOS almost hacked itself before it was even launched lmao.
xD LMAO ROFL PWNED

Jesus christ, I don't even care at this point. Enjoy taking your Ethereum bags to the grave with you.

>>10797163
That was a random smartcontract. Any pageet is free to create shitty buggy contracts, this is the nature of decentralisation. Not only was it not the fault of the Ethereum devs, they actually tried to fix it
>An Ethereum developer on GitHub pointed out a flaw relating to "recursive calls" in early June
Forks to fix catastrophic failures are an essential part of any robust protocol. The rejected parity fork shows how reliable that system is.
> EOS almost hacked itself before it was even launched lmao.
>xD LMAO ROFL PWNED
It did. A team of Chinese researchers had to beg them to make crucial patches.

>>10794278
>by buying monero you're betting on btc+eth never improving privacy long term
high quality shill, you are hell of a salesman unironically