/biz/ - Business & Finance

This isn't FUD either, noone actually has an argument for it.

fuck u i just mine and hold eth

> It's pretty obvious by now 99% of these coins won't recover.

Every drop this is said over and over, but when BTC surges all the alt coins go through the roof

>>10069525
Just because you're an autistic genius who can invest next paradigm data structure doesn't mean you have any fucking clue about how financial markets work... and guess what, crypto is now a financial market. Vitalik can run around spazzing about shit being overvalued all day long, but he's fucking WRONG. Value is what people are willing to pay, and people are willing to pay these prices. That's really all there is to it. Don't conflate one type of intellect with another, Vitalik is legitimately retard level when it comes to understanding why people are paying the prices they are, which is why he keeps getting angry about it. Imagine being a genius who can't understand such a simple concept. He's an idiot savant.

>>10069983
The alt market is still relatively new. During peak prices alts were extremely overvalued. alts are down 90% across the board, they won't recover because they are worthless.

>>10070012
agree and your stretching it saying he was around since the beginning - he's only 23 i think now

>>10070012
People aren't willing to pay these prices, which is why the alt market is down 90%.

>>10070050
Vitalik Buterin is a co-founder of Bitcoin Magazine who has been involved in the Bitcoin community since 2011, and has contributed to Bitcoin both as a writer and the developer of a fork of bitcoinjs-lib, pybitcointools and multisig.info, as well as one of the developers behind Egora. Now, Vitalik's primary job is as the main developer of Ethereum, a project which intends to create a next-generation smart contract and decentralized application platform that allows people to create any kind of decentralized application on top of a blockchain that can be imagined.

People are going to want real life use cases and products for these alts now before investing, which 99% of them will fail because they just took advantage of the alt bubble.

>>10069525
What are your thoughts on exchanges that share trading fee transactions with token holders?

>>10070172
those tokens will get absolutely rekt by the SEC. Exchanges are the only thing profitable in crypto. The whole things is just a house of cards waiting to collapse. Crypto never reached mainstream success like it did in Dec/Jan. All of those people got burned and lost just about their entire investment. They aren't going to come back and pump up alts again.

There has been 10's of billions raised in ICO's and there's not one company that's profitable that isn't an exchange. How is this not a red flag to you people?

>>10070581
it is. what biz hasn't realized yet is that 98 percent of all alts need to die before bitcoin can truly recover.

>>10070581
>>10070520
>>10070142
>>10070120
>>10070066
>>10070044
>>10069822
>>10069525
t. Salty nocoiner looking for validation

Why do people trade commodities like oil or copper? They could just buy the oil they need to make gasoline and don't need to buy any more after that, right? That's your logic.

People speculate on all kinds of shit, blockchain happens to be actually useful and lends itself well to speculation though.

It's the fucking J curve dude. Back in 1999 there were more people who owned shares of pets.com than people who had actually ordered anything off the internet ever.

The unique thing about revolutionary technologies is that they can be simultaneously overvalued (short term) and undervalued (long term).

Open your eyes and look at the bigger picture.

This will surely take off into orbit https://www.theaccountingblockchain.io/?aId=7543845-2892534

>>10070790
daily reminder that the closest we have to real world applications is cryptokitties.

>>10069525
>You can use the tech behind them without tokens.
No you can't....

>>10069525
>Even the creator of Ethereum acknowledges the insanity around these speculative prices.
Vitalik knows about as much about economics as he does about social interaction. There's a reason Ethereum still has no successful dapps after 3 years.

You're right about most coins being shitcoins. There are only 2-3 legit projects in crypto right now.

>>10070926
are you retarded? You think blockchain can only be used in conjunction with tokens?

>>10070833
That's your argument?

In the dotcom bubble, most of those companies were basically a web address. No one was buying anything from them, revenue was basically nonexistent, yet it peaked at 6 TRILLION in 2000 dollars (with inflation that's like a 10-12tril bubble in today's dollars).

And bitcoin isn't a real world use case? In certain markets bitcoin is the ONLY payment method.

>>10070790
Problem is again, you own no equity in these companies. You own tokens that carry no inherent value to the companies business model. They shit out one or 2 token utilities so morons buy it and think it's valuable. Perfect example is dapps. The fuk do they need a token for when they could just take payment in ETH? That would actually give ETH value. Instead they raise 20 million and can't even develop a working app that people use and you cucks get stuck holding tokens.

>>10070520
Tfw literally not a single US investor in the decentralised ICO exchange. So what if the SEC had no power over those exchanges?

>>10071002
Eh no? But if a service provider only provides a service in return for tokens, then you need to get tokens to use the service. Simple.

>>10071042
So you're mad because you didn't read the whitepaper and didn't realize that you bought actual shitcoins that are only valuable within the business model of the distributor?

Yeah, in that case you are probably gonna lose your money.

Currencies and platforms are where the real upside is. Utility and Security tokens are moronic investments because you need the individual company to stay in business on top of needing their business model to give lucrative rewards to token holders. It's double the risk with minimal rewards comparative to blockchain platforms/currencies.

>>10071017
Bitcoin isn't a company, it's a currency. It was meant to be used for p2p transactions, but it's too bloated and slow so now it's been named a "store of value". The network is valued at 100 billion. A fraction of people control the network and we've seen tons of bullshit as a result "BCH". I'm reading now that a fraction of miners is becoming close to having 51% of the mining power. Bitcoin is extremely overvalued as it has multiple obstacles to overcome before it can reach true adoption. Needs a better consensus algorithm, needs faster transactions, needs easier ways for users to interact with it ect. ETH isn't even decentralized. The DAO hack proved this when vitalik decided fork against majority to retrieve stolen funds.

>>10071156
why would you need multiple global currencies? This is just idiotic. A platform such as ETH again can be used without tokens. Your tokens are worthless.

https://www.ibm.com/blockchain/hyperledger?S_PKG=CoG&cm_mmc=Search_Google-_-Blockchain_Blockchain-_-WW_NA-_-+blockchain++fabric_Broad_CoG&cm_mmca1=000026VG&cm_mmca2=10007330&cm_mmca7=9008135&cm_mmca8=kwd-442177006209&cm_mmca9=39fe5d09-6bbf-429e-a479-cf22273e0de4&cm_mmca10=275984190384&cm_mmca11=b&mkwid=39fe5d09-6bbf-429e-a479-cf22273e0de4|1298|33170&cvosrc=ppc.google.%2Bblockchain%20%2Bfabric&cvo_campaign=000026VG&cvo_crid=275984190384&Matchtype=b

>>10071076
https://www.ibm.com/blockchain/hyperledger?S_PKG=CoG&cm_mmc=Search_Google-_-Blockchain_Blockchain-_-WW_NA-_-+blockchain++fabric_Broad_CoG&cm_mmca1=000026VG&cm_mmca2=10007330&cm_mmca7=9008135&cm_mmca8=kwd-442177006209&cm_mmca9=39fe5d09-6bbf-429e-a479-cf22273e0de4&cm_mmca10=275984190384&cm_mmca11=b&mkwid=39fe5d09-6bbf-429e-a479-cf22273e0de4|1298|33170&cvosrc=ppc.google.%2Bblockchain%20%2Bfabric&cvo_campaign=000026VG&cvo_crid=275984190384&Matchtype=b


your service is simply computing power. Do you think it's hard for companies to set up there own computing farms spread across the globe. The only thing that makes sense to use publicly is a currency like bitcoin. Your altcoins are worthless.

>>10071219
>>10071163
Lurk more newfag

You're right at the peak of mount stupid

>>10071260
and yet nothing I've said has been refuted.

>>10069525
He said it's hard to say decentralized oracles are worth 32m. He doesn't know shit about valuation. He probably goes off the idea that "it's worth however much it costs to build it", and he's extremely wrong.

>>10071249
The service isn't computing power, it's the computing power being directed towards some service provider's code, which they have sometimes spent years developing. E.g. Golem rendering, e.g. Augur's predictions contracts.

Golem and Augur's service doesn't magically exist just because blockchain exists. They are not offering these services for cash. You can only use these services if you buy tokens.

>>10071455
Which any company can replicate and not use tokens with.

>>10071479
They can replicate the basics of the contract with reverse engineering, they can't replicate the company or brand.

And if they don't use tokens, they need users to pay in ETH anyway, because they need to pay miners gas fees to run the contracts.

>>10070790
Fuhrer comfy with Xbox One because he bought:

-FUEL
-LUN
-YOYO

>tfw only own ETH and BTC
>might still make it

>>10071544
The price of ETH will have to reflect the value of the tokens running on it, or else there's an incentive to attack the chain. The more good ERC-20 tokens/products, the better.

>>10071351
Did you read anything I posted?

You need to lurk moar because your arguments are mostly irrelevant and in some cases actually blatantly wrong.

Examples:
>why would you need multiple global currencies?
Why does there need to be one global currency? People used silver AND gold in the past, one currency doesn't make all others irrelevant, competition is good. Everything has a USD value but people don't pay with USD for everything.
>A platform such as ETH again can be used without tokens.
No it can't.
>Your tokens are worthless.
Maybe yours are. But last I checked ETH is worth $435.33. Things are worth what people will pay for them you screeching autist.
>Bitcoin isn't a company, it's a currency.....blah blah blah.....vitalik decided fork against majority to retrieve stolen funds.
You just reference a bunch of shit that everyone who's been in crypto over a month already knows and already has baked into the price. This is why you need to lurk moar because you haven't presented any new or even uncommon arguments. Just lurk for a week and you wouldn't sound like a 15 year old who watched a couple crypto youtube vids on satoshi nakamoto and is now blockchain expert #1.

MOUNT STUPID